T-Mobile LTE & Network Discussion

[vtimmy13]

Ergen i think would of been the worst thing to happen to sprint ever.. good luck T-mobile good luck!

[Rawvega]

I wonder what smart alec response John-boy (or one of his corporate slaves) would have if he were tweeted about this little faux pas. 

[Paynefanbro]

My post made it to the What's Hot page on Google+! I posted about Sprint's LTE network on Sensorly and how it still outsizes T-Mobile LTE network, with people coming back with, "Your maps are wrong! There is no Sprint LTE in Detroit! You're a Sprint employee! blah blah blah" 

 

Little do they know, I can't see the haters!

[hxnk134]

My post made it to the What's Hot page on Google+! I posted about Sprint's LTE network on Sensorly and how it still outsizes T-Mobile LTE network, with people coming back with, "Your maps are wrong! There is no Sprint LTE in Detroit! You're a Sprint employee! blah blah blah"

 

Little do they know, I can't see the haters!

Interesting they made that comment about Detroit cause you can go to sensorly and see the LTE.

[S4GRU]

Interesting they made that comment about Detroit cause you can go to sensorly and see the LTE.

Facts can be inconvenient to Haters. We see it all day long.

 

Robert from Note 2 using Tapatalk 4 Beta

 

 

[hxnk134]

I wonder what smart alec response John-boy (or one of his corporate slaves) would have if he were tweeted about this little faux pas.

This is huge. We now have a concrete example of Legere being not just bombastic but a liar in his representation of TMO's service.

 

Yes, everyone fudges coverage maps but at least they have those asterisks: "may be totally exaggerated".

But using 10x10 spectrum of another carrier and then passing that off as representative of your service is a new low.

Edited July 13, 2013 by hxnk134

[Nickel]

Exactly. A few tech journalists are talking to Verizon about this. It's already been escalated to Verizon's engineering team. I can't wait to hear more about this.

If Verizon never knew about this, this could be subject to huge FCC sanctions, and a serious federal offense.

Whoa, I can't imagine what would happen if this were to be true. Also, who signed off on that? wouldn't you make sure that you had some kind of lease in place before even considering doing an event like that?

[hxnk134]

Whoa, I can't imagine what would happen if this were to be true. Also, who signed off on that? wouldn't you make sure that you had some kind of lease in place before even considering doing an event like that?

I hope TMO gets shamed publicly but not fined millions.

[Nickel]

I hope TMO gets shamed publicly but not fined millions.

If they seriously did this without Verizon's permission, there could be serious repercussions.

[WiWavelength]

Guys, as exciting a prospect as a "spectrum heist" might be, I think that nothing will come of T-Mobile's use of the AWS A block 20 MHz license that it had previously transferred to VZW and even terminated its leased usage of said spectrum.  As long as T-Mobile had VZW's permission to use the license temporarily, then all is probably kosher.  I still would have liked to see a short term, undefined area lease centered on T-Mobile's event -- was it at the Javits Center?  I will keep an eye on the FCC ULS to see if any application cuts through the red tape retroactively.  But you also have to recall that affiliates used Sprint's licensed spectrum for many years via an internal agreement with Sprint, not an FCC lease.

 

AJ

[Moropo]

Does anyone have any knowledge as to how T-Mobile's network is in the Miami urban area? Thanks.

[Nickel]

I said if they didn't have Verizon's permission, there could be serious consequences. Of course, I know what will happen even if they didn't have permission at the time, T-Mobile will probably pay Verizon so they don't say anything.

[milan03]

Guys, as exciting a prospect as a "spectrum heist" might be, I think that nothing will come of T-Mobile's use of the AWS A block 20 MHz license that it had previously transferred to VZW and even terminated its leased usage of said spectrum.  As long as T-Mobile had VZW's permission to use the license temporarily, then all is probably kosher.  I still would have liked to see a short term, undefined area lease centered on T-Mobile's event -- was it at the Javits Center?  I will keep an eye on the FCC ULS to see if any application cuts through the red tape retroactively.  But you also have to recall that affiliates used Sprint's licensed spectrum for many years via an internal agreement with Sprint, not an FCC lease.

 

AJ

Close, it was at the Skylight West on West 36th Street http://skylightnyc.com.

Remember that other presser they've had at the Midtown East back in march, they also ran 2x10Mhz, I'm suspecting now A block as well. That time they had dumb reporters that never thought about running ServiceMode, so I can't confirm on that one.

 

It's so deceiving since they're all about the "customers", but no customers get 2x10Mhz LTE in that same New York City.

[hxnk134]

Close, it was at the Skylight West on West 36th Street http://skylightnyc.com.

Remember that other presser they've had at the Midtown East back in march, they also ran 2x10Mhz, I'm suspecting now A block as well. That time they had dumb reporters that never thought about running ServiceMode, so I can't confirm on that one.

 

It's so deceiving since they're all about the "customers", but no customers get 2x10Mhz LTE in that same New York City.

At least in one year they will but lying about this was completely pointless. What average consumer will even remember how fast TMO's demo was when they think about which carrier's LTE to buy? They'll go to the stores and run speedtests - or not - and they'll buy service based on price and a commercial.

[bucdenny]

I said if they didn't have Verizon's permission, there could be serious consequences. Of course, I know what will happen even if they didn't have permission at the time, T-Mobile will probably pay Verizon so they don't say anything.

 

http://www.engadget.com/2013/03/18/t-mobile-lte-network-expansion/

 

Looks like Engadget did some of their own speed test...?  I would assume this is not the same thing..

[Nickel]

http://www.engadget.com/2013/03/18/t-mobile-lte-network-expansion/

 

Looks like Engadget did some of their own speed test...?  I would assume this is not the same thing..

No, what we're talking about is T-mobile held an event in NYC someone tweeted some speeds and then someone else (or the same person I don't remember) posted the Samsung LTE engineering screen where it showed that the center downlink frequency falls in the AWS A block. Which would be fine, except for the fact that the AWS A block belongs to Verizon and there isn't any proof yet that shows that they had any right to use that block for the event.

 

Now, if Verizon gave them permission, then there's no big deal but if they didn't, that's where things get interesting.

[Ascertion]

Did T-Mobile need to replace their panels? According to T-Mobiles coverage map, my area has 4g LTE but I never saw work done to the site they're on. Just curious.

[Dkoellerwx]

Did T-Mobile need to replace their panels? According to T-Mobiles coverage map, my area has 4g LTE but I never saw work done to the site they're on. Just curious.

 

They just added new ones, fairly quick work.

[Ascertion]

They just added new ones, fairly quick work.

I'll have to check out the new panels then next time I drive by it.

[Dkoellerwx]

I'll have to check out the new panels then next time I drive by it.

 

Should be the Ericsson Air antennas. 

[lilotimz]

Should be the Ericsson Air antennas. 

 

Not all T-mobile sites are getting new antennas. The other reason T-mobile so rapidly deployed LTE was that they also utilized existing antennas and just added Ericsson RRU4s and RRU12s (same RRU's Verizon & Sprint are using) to existing sites due to a shortage of AIR 21's. 

[Dkoellerwx]

Not all T-mobile sites are getting new antennas. The other reason T-mobile so rapidly deployed LTE was that they also utilized existing antennas and just added Ericsson RRU4s and RRU12s (same RRU's Verizon & Sprint are using) to existing sites due to a shortage of AIR 21's. 

 

Interesting. I know that not all markets are the same, but I assumed it was since I had already seen pictures of the Air antennas deployed in Florida.

[lilotimz]

Interesting. I know that not all markets are the same, but I assumed it was since I had already seen pictures of the Air antennas deployed in Florida.

 

Milan explained it better over @ hofo 

 

 

 

 

[Today I had a privilege to visit one of the rooftop T-Mobile sites. Wasn't allowed to take any photos, but got so much valuable information from the crew.

 

The site wasn't AIR 21, they're using older existing AXP16 panels with three new Ericsson RRU 12 or 04 remote radio heads. One for HSPA, one larger one for GSM, and one for LTE. http://cuedee.se/sites/default/files/small%203_990608.jpg

Was told that T-Mobile initially didn't have enough supply of AIR 21's, and that they wanted to rapidly deploy LTE, so they started slapping RRU's to the existing 6yr old panels. The rumor is that they'll try to come back and replace these panels with AIR 21 at the latter time, if the roof construction allows it. AIR 21's are much heavier panels, 100+ lbs each.

 

Usually running two panels one for GSM and HSPA in the PCS, and other for AWS LTE/HSPA+. They always go for 120 degrees positioning on each end of the roof if possible.

 

They still had old 2G Nortel cabinets in place that have been decommissioned, just sitting there, and brand new RBS 6131 upgraded from 3106. Fiber fed from the basement, they didn't know what the backhaul was. I'm hoping more than 50Mbps... Router was Alcatel/Lucent 7705 with gig card installed at the front, essentially ready for very high backhaul.

 

I was told that T-Mobile is instructing them to hide RRU's as much as possible so they try to instal them below the parapet walls to hide them from the public. In some cases they have to install them right behind the antennas because of the wall issues.

Their initial goal was to upgrade about 1,750 existing T-Mobile sites in five boroughs, so far they've don about 1,100. They're hearing that that number will increase to over 2,000, which includes brand new cell sites.

 

In my zip code there are 9 T-Mobile sites, 8 of them already modernized. The 9th one should be upgraded soon, I'm hoping to be there while being upgraded.  

It usually takes only two days for an existing site to be upgraded according to the crew. About 30days for brand new sites.

 

 

 

 

[ericdabbs]

Not all T-mobile sites are getting new antennas. The other reason T-mobile so rapidly deployed LTE was that they also utilized existing antennas and just added Ericsson RRU4s and RRU12s (same RRU's Verizon & Sprint are using) to existing sites due to a shortage of AIR 21's. 

 

I did not know that Tmobile was still sticking with RRUs for their "Network Vision" project for LTE/PCS HSPA+ deployment.  I just would have assumed Tmobile was moving towards all Ericsson AIR antennas for all of its cell sites because of the simplicity benefits of the BTS ans power savings.

[jefbal99]

I did not know that Tmobile was still sticking with RRUs for their "Network Vision" project for LTE/PCS HSPA+ deployment.  I just would have assumed Tmobile was moving towards all Ericsson AIR antennas for all of its cell sites because of the simplicity benefits of the BTS ans power savings.

I've read earlier in this thread that there is a shortage of the AIR antenna/panels so they needed the RRUs to keep their pace.