Marcelo Claure, Town Hall Meetings, New Family Share Pack Plan, Unlimited Individual Plan, Discussion Thread

[MacinJosh]

As long as I don't have to pay interest, I'm fine with it. And was this only for leasing, or do devices that are bought on Easy Pay become part of this deal?

 

 

Sent from my Gold iPhone 6s Plus 128GB using Tapatalk

[Ascertion]

Inside threads? Wow. And we can't even upgrade to a better version for money anymore.

I'm on a modified Tapatalk v4.9.5. Best version to date. And since it's modded, play store doesn't prompt me to update.

 

Sent from my Nexus 5X

[jasonsteele]

Inside threads? Wow. And we can't even upgrade to a better version for money anymore.

Just reinstalled Tapatalk Pro. I kind of missed the old layout, like an old friend. I think I'll stay here awhile.

[RedSpark]

The question is, how does this affect us as customers leasing devices?

Sent from my Gold iPhone 6s Plus 128GB using Tapatalk

It might give Sprint the ability (and liquidity) to move ahead with launching Android Forever.

[Deval]

First off, even if T-Mobile got 700 MHz nationwide they'd still not have a circuit switched fallback in a whole lot of places. Funny how Mr. Ali neglects that point. He himself had to abandon T-Mobile and go back to Verizon because they had better coverage in his hometown of Pittsburgh, PA. Not exactly a place in the sticks. Fair enough that Verizon has eliminated their contracts, but guess what, they wanted to do that all along. I hold no grudge against T-Mobile making money but they might be better off just charging more and not tossing away gimmicks like Music Freedom and BingeOn. Sure T-Mobile's gaining a lot off AT&T and Sprint, but that has more to do with AT&T not acting like they care all that much about mobile anymore and Sprint, well, imploding. Is T-Mobile really gaining that much off Verizon? From the looks of it, the answer is NO. 

 

I think even that tide is slowing (customers porting from Sprint to T-Mobile). There are some markets where Sprint is actually net port positive against all 3 carriers, offset by other markets where they are not.

[scubajwd]

Let me examine the economics of leasing...lets see...what does it cost me to have a new

phone each year..lets see.. $30/mo X 12= $360..say for three years..I've spent $1080 on new

phones and don't own anything..so after three years I have no phone..my wife's Galaxy 3 is

still going strong and my Note4 will be paid off pretty soon..I guess Apple figured that the only way

to grab market share from Samsung (when no one could afford an $800 iPhone) was to somehow

fleece the sheep with lo-cost leases; $25 or $30 a month is painless isn't it?  Tells me that the

margins on this hardware must be north of 60-70%...wow what a money maker for the carriers!

All you need is a population of sheep that can't figure out they are being fleeced!! 

[cletus]

Let me examine the economics of leasing...lets see...what does it cost me to have a new

phone each year..lets see.. $30/mo X 12= $360..say for three years..I've spent $1080 on new

phones and don't own anything..so after three years I have no phone..my wife's Galaxy 3 is

still going strong and my Note4 will be paid off pretty soon..I guess Apple figured that the only way

to grab market share from Samsung (when no one could afford an $800 iPhone) was to somehow

fleece the sheep with lo-cost leases; $25 or $30 a month is painless isn't it?  Tells me that the

margins on this hardware must be north of 60-70%...wow what a money maker for the carriers!

All you need is a population of sheep that can't figure out they are being fleeced!! 

So it all depends on your use case, really. With the loyalty credit etc leasing is really quite attractive. 

 

For your example there are definitely downsides such as for your current phones: Your wife's S3 has only band 25 LTE access so she is missing on on b26 for building penetration and b41 for speed. Your current phone DOES have b41 but doesn't have carrier aggregation. Depending on the market, no CA isn't necessarily a big deal.

 

So, lets compare iPhone and Note costs with 2 scenarios:

 

2 Years

Lets say you want an iPhone 6s. 

Leasing: $15/mo. (or even less with loyalty credit) over 2 years you would pay $360. 

Buying: $27.09/mo over 2 years you would pay $650.16 and own the phone.

 

But how much will that phone be worth? Well, lets compare the iphone 6s value now vs the 5s value (to approximate the value of a 2 yr old iPhone that you will have) on Swappa it goes for ~$160 - $180 for a 16 GB model. So in this example you are down $110 in terms of net cost to you with the higher estimate ($650 - $360 - $180). Okay so what about 3 years?

 

3 Years

Leasing: $15/mo. (or even less with loyalty credit) over 2 years you would pay $360.  But for the sake of fairness lets use the $22/mo non promo price for the 3rd year which is another $264 for a total of $624

Buying: $27.09/mo over 2 years you would pay $650.16 and own the phone. 

 

But how much will that phone be worth? Well, lets compare the iphone 6s value now vs the 5 value (to approximate the value of a 3 yr old iPhone that you will have) on Swappa it goes for ~$125 for a 16 GB model. So in this example you are up ~$100 in terms of net cost to you ($650 - 624- $125). 

 

For a Note device that might be a harder choice.

2 Years

Lets say you want a Note 5. 

Leasing: $25/mo. 2 years you would pay $600 

Buying: $30.80/mo over 2 years you would pay $739.18 and own the phone. 

 

But how much will that phone be worth? Well, lets compare the Note 5 value now vs the Note 3 value on Swappa it goes for ~$170. So in this example you are up ~$30 ($739.18- $600 - $170). Okay so what about 3 years?

 

3 Years

Lets say you want a Note 5. 

Leasing: $25/mo. 3 years you would pay $900 

Buying: $30.80/mo over 3 years you would pay $739.18 and own the phone. 

 

But how much will that phone be worth? Well, lets compare the Note 5 value now vs the Note 2 value on Swappa it goes for ~$115 So in this example you are up a whopping $275 ($739.18- $900- $115). 

 

The differentiation here is if you add in the loyalty credit to these calculations it comes $120 less for each year of lease which is extremely compelling seeing as even in the best case, 3 year old Note example you would STILL be ahead leasing and have a newer phone.

 

The real money saver would be to buy 1 year or 2 year old used phones every year and then resell them. You might have a total cost of only $75 or so/year. It all depends how important having a new phone is to you. To my wife, having a new iPhone yearly was an easy choice. For myself I buy Nexus phones every 2 years and thus far the net cost to me has been fantastic.

[scubajwd]

So it all depends on your use case, really. With the loyalty credit etc leasing is really quite attractive. 

 

For your example there are definitely downsides such as for your current phones: Your wife's S3 has only band 25 LTE access so she is missing on on b26 for building penetration and b41 for speed. Your current phone DOES have b41 but doesn't have carrier aggregation. Depending on the market, no CA isn't necessarily a big deal.

 

So, lets compare iPhone and Note costs with 2 scenarios:

 

2 Years

Lets say you want an iPhone 6s. 

Leasing: $15/mo. (or even less with loyalty credit) over 2 years you would pay $360. 

Buying: $27.09/mo over 2 years you would pay $650.16 and own the phone.

 

But how much will that phone be worth? Well, lets compare the iphone 6s value now vs the 5s value (to approximate the value of a 2 yr old iPhone that you will have) on Swappa it goes for ~$160 - $180 for a 16 GB model. So in this example you are down $110 in terms of net cost to you with the higher estimate ($650 - $360 - $180). Okay so what about 3 years?

 

3 Years

Leasing: $15/mo. (or even less with loyalty credit) over 2 years you would pay $360.  But for the sake of fairness lets use the $22/mo non promo price for the 3rd year which is another $264 for a total of $624

Buying: $27.09/mo over 2 years you would pay $650.16 and own the phone. 

 

But how much will that phone be worth? Well, lets compare the iphone 6s value now vs the 5 value (to approximate the value of a 3 yr old iPhone that you will have) on Swappa it goes for ~$125 for a 16 GB model. So in this example you are up ~$100 in terms of net cost to you ($650 - 624- $125). 

 

For a Note device that might be a harder choice.

2 Years

Lets say you want a Note 5. 

Leasing: $25/mo. 2 years you would pay $600 

Buying: $30.80/mo over 2 years you would pay $739.18 and own the phone. 

 

But how much will that phone be worth? Well, lets compare the Note 5 value now vs the Note3 value on Swappa it goes for ~$170. So in this example you are up ~$30 ($739.18- $600 - $170). Okay so what about 3 years?

 

3 Years

Lets say you want a Note 5. 

Leasing: $25/mo. 3 years you would pay $900 

Buying: $30.80/mo over 3 years you would pay $739.18 and own the phone. 

 

But how much will that phone be worth? Well, lets compare the Note 5 value now vs the Note3 value on Swappa it goes for ~$115 So in this example you are up a whopping $275 ($739.18- $900- $115). 

 

The differentiation here is if you add in the loyalty credit to these calculations it comes $120 less for each year of lease which is extremely compelling seeing as even in the best case, 3 year old Note example you would STILL be ahead leasing and have a newer phone.

 

The real money saver would be to buy 1 year or 2 year old used phones every year and then resell them. You might have a total cost of only $75 or so/year. It all depends how important having a new phone is to you. To my wife, having a new iPhone yearly was an easy choice. For myself I buy Nexus phones every 2 years and thus far the net cost to me has been fantastic.

Cletus..your math is compelling on the issue if indeed many qualify for the loyalty credit as I and you might do so( I've

been a loyal Sprint customer since 2002, BTW); I suspect many millennials and even Gen-Xers will take to the leasing

model even if the rates are higher and they do not have the loyalty credit!  The main thrust of my argument, however, has

to do with the carriers attempts at grabbing share via making the high margin flagship phones SEEM affordable to the masses;

this together with BingeOn tactics of TMO ( to be copied by the other carriers eventually) and it seems to me that it's

a massive waste of capital and network resource...someone above said something like "well with this new TMO binge

plan my neighbor can binge on Hulu while I get about 2G speeds on my handset."  ..all of this is tied together and it's hard for

me to see the endgame here..

[Johnner1999]

Cletus..your math is compelling on the issue if indeed many qualify for the loyalty credit as I and you might do so( I've

been a loyal Sprint customer since 2002, BTW); I suspect many millennials and even Gen-Xers will take to the leasing

model even if the rates are higher and they do not have the loyalty credit!  The main thrust of my argument, however, has

to do with the carriers attempts at grabbing share via making the high margin flagship phones SEEM affordable to the masses;

this together with BingeOn tactics of TMO ( to be copied by the other carriers eventually) and it seems to me that it's

a massive waste of capital and network resource...someone above said something like "well with this new TMO binge

plan my neighbor can binge on Hulu while I get about 2G speeds on my handset."  ..all of this is tied together and it's hard for

me to see the endgame here..

 

 

I don't think the carriers make much money off of phones!  in fact I suspect they would rather not sell lease any of them!  BUT that would increase the friction to use the service - so I totally get that need.  

 

And as Cletus has shown (many times and very well as always) leasing is a great way to "buy" a phone.   Especially with technology getting better and better - on the carrier side.  

 

That said I'm all for "cheap" phones like the Moto G!   But I'd never hand over $600-800 for an iPhone or Samsung's best -- i could use that money for many other things - since the carrier doesn't charge an interest reate - and many of the will shave off some of the access fee's.   

 

as with all things its all personal choice -- but I'm not sure i'd say we are sheep on this one... 

[gusherb]

I think even that tide is slowing (customers porting from Sprint to T-Mobile). There are some markets where Sprint is actually net port positive against all 3 carriers, offset by other markets where they are not.

I agree. Everyone I personally know that was gonna switch to T-Mobile has done it already. The Sprint users I know still with Sprint aren't going anywhere. (I think I only know two or three now). Once upon a time Sprint used to be the second most subscribed to carrier in my market right behind AT&T (from a source that was on here a few years ago) and I wouldn't be surprised if Sprint re-takes that place in a couple of years.

[dnicekid]

One thing to add is your getting a new phone every year.

I used to pay an avg of $200 plus the built in $~15+ per month

So $180 per year plus $200 down

Avg of 380 per year to have a new phone every year on contract.

 

An iPhone at 25x12 is $300 still cheaper

It's the same with cars leasing is always cheaper UNLESS you buy and keep for several years. In the phone world leasing is cheaper as well. After about 2.5 years owning is cheaper which in today's world most people don't retain a phone longer than 2 years. I can't think of one company whose technology hasn't changed either where a new phone will benefit customer

Example

Sprint

WiMAX

Lte

Triband

2x ca

Next year 3+ ca

Wi fi calling is new

[NYC126]

I think even that tide is slowing (customers porting the party is coming to an end.  Sprint to T-Mobile). There are some markets where Sprint is actually net port positive against all 3 carriers, offset by other markets where they are not.

Why do you think the pink Lord went into a rant after Marcelo announced those plans. I think the party is coming to an end. 

 

Tmobile has been taking customers mostly from Sprint and AT&T, but Verizon haven't blink.  Hell Tmobile launched a Verizon never settled campaign and that basically crashed.  Verizon has shown that it's the network,  gimmicks and a couple of extras gigs of tethering will not convince customers to switch. 

[cortney]

Why do you think the pink Lord went into a rant after Marcelo announced those plans. I think the party is coming to an end. 

 

I agree -- the desperation is hilarious. It became evident when Legere started attacking Verizon more than AT&T.

 

The trolls and PR shills don't have a clue what's going to happen in the long-term, either. That's unless some miracle occurs and part of that would likely be a new management, owner, and money.  

[Deval]

Why do you think the pink Lord went into a rant after Marcelo announced those plans. I think the party is coming to an end. 

 

Tmobile has been taking customers mostly from Sprint and AT&T, but Verizon haven't blink.  Hell Tmobile launched a Verizon never settled campaign and that basically crashed.  Verizon has shown that it's the network,  gimmicks and a couple of extras gigs of tethering will not convince customers to switch. 

 

I love Marcelo's response to calm down and stop panicking. 

[Deval]

I agree -- the desperation is hilarious. It became evident when Legere started attacking Verizon more than AT&T.

 

The trolls and PR shills don't have a clue what's going to happen in the long-term, either. That's unless some miracle occurs and part of that would likely be a new management, owner, and money.  

 

I'm in it for the long run, I know Sprint isn't going anywhere.

[Deval]

I agree. Everyone I personally know that was gonna switch to T-Mobile has done it already. The Sprint users I know still with Sprint aren't going anywhere. (I think I only know two or three now). Once upon a time Sprint used to be the second most subscribed to carrier in my market right behind AT&T (from a source that was on here a few years ago) and I wouldn't be surprised if Sprint re-takes that place in a couple of years.

 

I think they will always remain a solid #2 in Chicago, and the technology there will support the customer base for a long time.

 

I was there over the summer and loved every Sprint moment.

[Fraydog]

I agree -- the desperation is hilarious. It became evident when Legere started attacking Verizon more than AT&T.

 

The trolls and PR shills don't have a clue what's going to happen in the long-term, either. That's unless some miracle occurs and part of that would likely be a new management, owner, and money.  

 

What I see happening two things:

 

1. T-Mobile cracks up on network speeds and Big Red, steady as ever, starts peeling off customers and porting ratios on Verizon go negative. 

2. AT&T senior management finally wakes up and realizes that they have to invest in their core businesses here and not Mexico/DirecTV and then they too start to correct the massive porting ratio fail they have right now. 

 

I'm not really to commit that Sprint can turn around until I see results. I have just been burned too many times. I know Sprint is a company based in Kansas but my motto on them at this point is Missouri - "show me." Trying to turn around the balance sheet and continue network improvements isn't going to be easy. It's doable - but execution has to improve. 

[bigsnake49]

What I see happening two things:

 

1. T-Mobile cracks up on network speeds and Big Red, steady as ever, starts peeling off customers and porting ratios on Verizon go negative. 

2. AT&T senior management finally wakes up and realizes that they have to invest in their core businesses here and not Mexico/DirecTV and then they too start to correct the massive porting ratio fail they have right now. 

 

I'm not really to commit that Sprint can turn around until I see results. I have just been burned too many times. I know Sprint is a company based in Kansas but my motto on them at this point is Missouri - "show me." Trying to turn around the balance sheet and continue network improvements isn't going to be easy. It's doable - but execution has to improve. 

 

Sprint needs to become economically efficient and execute in the field. No two ways about it. Their survival depends on it. I do not believe that T-Mobile and Sprint will thrive, ever. They might survive but will not thrive. Not at the prices they're charging. They both have accumulated tremendous amounts of debt to the point that Sprint cannot borrow any more money to participate in the 600MHz auction. T-Mobile will pay an ungodly amount of money adding to their already staggering debt.

[dedub]

almost 10000 posts

[kct1975]

almost 10000 posts

Yup!

 

Who would have guessed...

 

This thread has truly become a Town Hall for this site, which is great! [emoji106]

[WiWavelength]

almost 10000 posts

Yup!

 

Who would have guessed...

 

This thread has truly become a Town Hall for this site, which is great! [emoji106]

 

Only 10,000 posts?  Staff view of this thread shows that this post already is #10,146.

 

However, we had to hide 145 of those posts because they revealed -- who killed Kennedy, the whereabouts of Jimmy Hoffa, a cure for cancer, and John Legere's SSN.  That other post we had to hide, well, it proved the Riemann hypothesis.

 

AJ

[markjcc]

This comment...

 

[dnicekid]

Liking the new sprint commercial

Says sprint is faster than att/vzw with lte plus

Good to claim something even if it isn't true in every market at least it will catch people's attention.

Then cut everyone's bill in half from the big 3.

About time

[markjcc]

Liking the new sprint commercial

Says sprint is faster than att/vzw with lte plus

Good to claim something even if it isn't true in every market at least it will catch people's attention.

Then cut everyone's bill in half from the big 3.

About time

 

I like it too, it boasts the new network speeds however I feel like the ad would have been better if they boasted coverage too.. with Improvements or something

 

This http://www.ispot.tv/ad/AkqR/sprint-the-worlds-best-network

 

Combined with their new ad http://www.ispot.tv/ad/AdXj/sprint-the-biggest-deal-in-us-wireless-history

[RedSpark]

T-Mobile cries copycat as Sprint flies banner over its Bellevue headquarters

 

Link: http://www.geekwire.com/2015/t-mobile-calls-copycat-as-sprint-flies-banner-of-its-bellevue-headquarters/

 

Awesome.