T-Mobile LTE & Network Discussion

[S4GRU]

Highly localized. It's completely YMMV.

 

This is my experience, exactly.  Highly localized.  But at its best, it can be used for audio streaming and checking emails and reading low bandwidth websites.  Sprint 3G in rural areas tends to way outperform EDGE.  And there is a lot more rural Sprint LTE and good performing rural Sprint 3G than there is high performance EDGE in my observations.

 

I would take a crude guess and say that in places where Sprint and Tmo overlap in rural areas, my Sprint 3G and LTE outperformed Tmo EDGE 95%+ of the time.  And I would further say that Sprint 1x rural data speeds are more consistent than Tmo EDGE too. 

 

Robert

[bigsnake49]

That was before everyone and their 2nd, 3rd, & 4th cousins joined in because the iPhone was exclusive, and trust me, AT&T edge was horrible before 3G was deployed in Pahrump. Also, I think Apple was compressing data on the original iPhone to make it worth the crappy EDGE data.

Maybe so, and maybe AT&T's Edge was much better than T-Mo because they probably had more channels available to them. Maybe Apple did compress data. But I am relating you my experience with the iPhone 1 on AT&T.  Nothing having to do T-Mobile Edge on 2014.

[maxsilver]

for their cherry picking of experience in their piddling little markets.

 

I will not let the great state of Michigan be talked down by a fellow from Lawrence, Kansas.    

 

(that's just a joke)

 

Not quite sure what name calling and belittling of people's experiences and markets adds to the discussion.

I wrote one rant a long time ago about how Sprint service is really bad in my market. Therefore, everyone's decided to view everything I write in an assumed "t-mobile fanboi" light, even though I'm almost always taking a fairly reasonable, fairly even stance in nearly everything I've posted here.

 

They also assume I'm always referring to my particular market (even though I actually travel fairly regularly to a bunch of different markets: 

 

I've been all through Washington (Seattle to Spokane, including Moses Lake and Ellensberg, and down to Tacoma -- after Spark officially launched), Las Vegas, Oklahoma City, Chicago (after Spark officially launched), Milwaukee, and all of urban Michigan (from coast to coast, Muskegon to Detroit and every city between).

 

 

I definitely skew urban over rural (and the vast majority of S4GRU skews rural or suburban).

 

But yep, I'm totally drawing from one "piddling little" market.

 

 

Just because they have had good experiences on GSM platforms/bad experiences on CDMA platforms, doesn't put a magenta T on their chest (Scarlet Letter reference). Peoples' experiences are legitimate.

 

Broad generalizations also exist for a reason, because GPRS/EDGE on T-Mobile often does suck. Same can be said for 1xRTT/EvDO on Sprint.

 

Be careful. Grounded, reasonable words like that will get you branded a "T-Mobile fanboi" too.

 

I agree with everything you've said there. And in case others missed it, *including* the "GRPS/EDGE often suck" -- I've never advocated otherwise, I simply said that on EDGE "e-mails still come through" and 1x data hasn't ever worked for me, and got hate piled on for it...

[S4GRU]

 

I wrote one rant a long time ago about how Sprint service is really bad in my market. Therefore, everyone's decided to view everything I write in an assumed "t-mobile fanboi" light, even though I'm almost always taking a fairly reasonable, fairly even stance in nearly everything I've posted here.

 

But yep, I'm totally drawing from one "piddling little" market.

 

I think I've given you a fair shake and even liked several of your posts.  I don't think you're a fan boy of anyone.  And I definitely concede that Sprint tower spacing in Grand Rapids is likely only worsted by Baton Rouge.  However, some of your posts have points that are certainly challengeable by S4GRU members.

 

Robert

[maxsilver]

I think I've given you a fair shake and even liked several of your posts.  I don't think you're a fan boy of anyone.

 

I agree completely. You've been exceptionally kind and fair.

Sorry, I probably should have directed that bit at AJ specifically, since he threw that label (in general, and today specifically). I didn't want to start a big back and forth about it, although now that I'm explaining it, I risk doing that anyway...

 

(I like everyone at S4GRU, and banhammers are scary)

 

But this is now terribly offtopic. Isn't this the thread where we complain about EDGE?  

 

you have (some) EDGE only sites that are useless for data.

 

Highly localized. It's completely YMMV.

I haven't seen any EDGE sites be totally useless for data (in my experience). But they are always dog slow. E-mail, maybe twitter or reddit (text only), but that's it. I've never gotten streaming of any kind to run on EDGE. Even if the site pulls a speedtest above 100k, multimedia still isn't usually functioning.

 

I *have* seen GPRS-only sites (yes, still, in 2014). We have a good handful of them. 

I haven't seen any outside of Michigan -- and not very many of them. But there's definitely some GPRS  here. And I'm convinced they've never had working data of any kind. Even e-mail and MMS don't function on these sites. Literally zero data.

[Mr.Nuke]

Exactly right.

 

And just like my experience of having usable data on HSPA with T-Mobile at the 2013 College World Series while all of the CSpire customers were stuck roaming on Sprint's 1x at TD Ameritrade Park.

 

This was before Sprint had Network Vision there. Also before T-Mobile modernized there as well.

Mississippi State fan I assume? Since you've been up here Sprint now has LTE on both band 25 and 26 at TD 8T8R Band 41 soon hopefully). I was pulling 4-12 mb/s down during the CWS this year. The site almost directly across the street from Brother Sebastian's has both 25/26 LTE as well. T-Mobile does have a site in close proximity to the stadium that to their credit has been upgraded to LTE, but again they're only running a protection network here that by-and-large solely covers Omaha's interstate system to keep their customers from roaming.

 

If you plug in Omaha zip code into T-Mobile's website it literally tells you "Please enter a valid U.S. ZIP Code." Really glad to know we (almost 1 million of us) in the Omaha metro don't exist Mr. Legere.

[lordsutch]

I have to say I've never experienced anything good on EDGE or GPRS with T-Mobile, but I've not traveled as widely as Robert with T-Mobile (mostly in the southeast). Certainly I've found that even roaming 1X with Verizon or ex-Alltel around here delivers a better experience.

 

All that said there are places where Sprint is lagging T-Mobile and, as pointed out elsewhere, Sprint is going to lose significant EVDO roaming in the southeast when AT&T inevitably switches off CDMA next year in its former Alltel markets (they'd rather lose roaming revenue than help Sprint make its maps prettier) and maybe the equation will change a bit if Sprint doesn't take advantage of ex-Nextel sites and accelerate 800 deployment on GMOs to improve rural coverage. Waiting around for SouthernLINC to come through in 2017 isn't going to cut it.

[S4GRU]

maybe the equation will change a bit if Sprint doesn't take advantage of ex-Nextel sites and accelerate 800 deployment on GMOs to improve rural coverage. Waiting around for SouthernLINC to come through in 2017 isn't going to cut it.

This is the biggest criticism I have of Sprint. Not converting 1,000 key iDEN sites to expand and densify the Sprint network. What a lost opportunity. And the GMO conversion needs to be a high priority now. Even if just to get off expensive T1's. It actually pays for itself in time.

 

Robert via Samsung Note 8.0 using Tapatalk Pro

[reedacus25]

Mississippi State fan I assume?

Spot on.

 

Doozy's on 16th was far and away my favorite eatery there. Great sandwiches and the owner could not have been any more personable or nice.

 

Since you've been up here Sprint now has LTE on both band 25 and 26 at TD 8T8R Band 41 soon hopefully). I was pulling 4-12 mb/s down during the CWS this year. The site almost directly across the street from Brother Sebastian's has both 25/26 LTE as well. T-Mobile does have a site in close proximity to the stadium that to their credit has been upgraded to LTE, but again they're only running a protection network here that by-and-large solely covers Omaha's interstate system to keep their customers from roaming.

 

If you plug in Omaha zip code into T-Mobile's website it literally tells you "Please enter a valid U.S. ZIP Code." Really glad to know we (almost 1 million of us) in the Omaha metro don't exist Mr. Legere.

Oh I'm well aware of how bad it is. When State was last in Omaha (2007) at Rosenblatt, my dad's Treo 650 was a brick. Granted it was exceptionally poor RF wise, but it baffled me that it would find zero service in a city like Omaha in an open air environment.

 

T-Mobile doesn't have any exchanges for any Nebraska area codes. Not terribly sure what is involved in making that happen, but they flat out can't service a local number.

 

Either way, as a tourist, it covered my needs for the time being. Sure there were big black holes, but I knew better than to expect miracles. It really wouldn't take TOO many sites to bring the network to a passable state. Mostly in the western suburbs like I mentioned.

 

Can't wait to get back to Omaha soon.

[milan03]

In my attempt to bring this on topic here is a screenshot of some PCS LTE action in rural OH. It appears to be a 10MHz channel, scanned using Nexus 5 without a SIM by @unforgiven512. 

 

[S4GRU]

In my attempt to bring this on topic here is a screenshot of some PCS action in rural OH. It appears to be a 10MHz slice.

 

I wasn't aware that Tmo had any Band 2 devices, yet. I guess the Nexus 5 does, but my Tmo SIM doesn't scan Band 2 in my N5. Although, I have to admit I don't follow Tmo device developments closely.

 

Robert via Samsung Note 8.0 using Tapatalk Pro

 

EDIT: I see you edited while I was typing. That's what I get for pausing to talk with the Misses.

[milan03]

I wasn't aware that Tmo had any Band 2 devices, yet. I guess the Nexus 5 does, but my Tmo SIM doesn't scan Band 2 in my N5. Although, I have to admit I don't follow Tmo device developments closely.

 

Robert via Samsung Note 8.0 using Tapatalk Pro

They have quite a few Band 2 devices seeded, mostly the ones that came out in H2 2013/14. It definitely helps that AT&T also uses Band 2.

Band 12 is a completely different story though.

[lilotimz]

They have quite a few Band 2 devices seeded, mostly the ones that came out in H2 2013/14. It definitely helps that AT&T also uses Band 2.

Band 12 is a completely different story though.

 

I recall NSN Band 2 Flexis being certified in the FCC around fall/winter of last year.  No clue if they're actually deploying those alongside their Band 4 ones. 

[milan03]

I recall NSN Band 2 Flexis being certified in the FCC around fall/winter of last year.  No clue if they're actually deploying those alongside their Band 4 ones. 

Band 2 LTE is right now being deployed in rural areas where PCS's already been used for 2G services. For now, they're not deploying AWS to those areas at all, it's purely PCS LTE/2G, plus 700MHz where possible.

 

This type of rollout allows them to rapidly deploy LTE using the least amount of resources. In many cases they're reusing the existing 1900MHz panels, only replacing the cabinets and adding RRUs. This also makes it much easier for their engineers to tune those PCS LTE sites, as they already have a pretty good idea how 1900MHz spreads and propagates around those 2G sites.

The backhaul seems to be in place as well: https://twitter.com/unforgiven512/status/502493782299123713/photo/1

[lilotimz]

Band 2 LTE is right now being deployed in rural areas where PCS's already been used for 2G services. For now, they're not deploying AWS to those areas at all, it's purely PCS LTE/2G, plus 700MHz where possible.

 

This type of rollout allows them to rapidly deploy LTE using the least amount of resources. In many cases they're reusing the existing 1900MHz panels, only replacing the cabinets and adding RRUs. The backhaul seems to be in place as well: https://twitter.com/unforgiven512/status/502493782299123713/photo/1

 

Yes yes. GMO setups. That I think all of us here know about.

 

What I was thinking about was if they were deploying them alongside the Band 4 flexis on their urban modernized sites. I don't believe they began the rural deployments in late 2013 and early 2014 iirc. 

[milan03]

Yes yes. GMO setups. That I think all of us here know about.

 

What I was thinking about was if they were deploying them alongside the Band 4 flexis on their urban modernized sites. I don't believe they began the rural deployments in late 2013 and early 2014 iirc. 

My understanding is that they were deploying Band 2 and Band 4 flexis to urban sites since day one, even though they're only using 1900MhHz licenses for HSPA+/GSM in those markets.

[EvanA]

Just found this on T-Mobile's website in their network management info....

To provide a good experience for the majority of our customers and minimize capacity issues and degradation in network performance, we may also take measures including temporarily reducing data throughput for a subset of customers who use a disproportionate amount of bandwidth. Customers who use more data than 95% of customers on the same rate plan typically use in a month may, during times and places of congestion, have their data usage prioritized below other customers.

Taken from: http://www.t-mobile.com/company/companyinfo.aspx?tp=Abt_Tab_ConsumerInfo&tsp=Abt_Sub_InternetServices

 

T-Mobile prioritizes the 5% just like everyone else, yet the fanboys outright deny it.

[Mr.Nuke]

T-Mobile doesn't have any exchanges for any Nebraska area codes. Not terribly sure what is involved in making that happen, but they flat out can't service a local number.

That seems to be the popular excuse, but if that is really the reason, it is about to go out the window. Omaha is adding a second area code in the near future.

 

I suspect a bigger part of it has to do with Omaha being arguably the one-time CDMA 2000 capital in the world. AT&T was late to the game in building out Omaha as well. They've done a really good job here though in the post iPhone era.

[Paynefanbro]

When Sprint employees troll T-Mobile stores! https://twitter.com/LuisMReynoso/status/502815051833958400/photo/1

[twospirits]

arg those comments. SMH

[S4GRU]

When Sprint customers troll T-Mobile stores! https://twitter.com/LuisMReynoso/status/502815051833958400/photo/1

Now Sprint should film a commercial showing Carly going around and planting them at Tmo stores. That would be awesome. She turns to the camera in her new hot yellow outfit and says "Shhhhh!" as she tiptoes in the middle of the night putting them up at Tmo stores.

 

Robert via Samsung Note 8.0 using Tapatalk Pro

[twospirits]

lol I love it.

[Destroyallcubes]

Now Sprint should film a commercial showing Carly going around and planting them at Tmo stores. That would be awesome. She turns to the camera in her new hot yellow outfit and says "Shhhhh!" as she tiptoes in the middle of the night putting them up at Tmo stores.

Robert via Samsung Note 8.0 using Tapatalk Pro

Make a spin off of the Samsung vs apple commercial. The magentites, in a line waiting for "uncarrier move x" and you see Sprint people running around with extra money from sprints already uncarrier move

[WiWavelength]

Now Sprint should film a commercial showing Carly...

 

Dan did Sprint commercials.  Maybe Marcelo will, too.  One idea could have a Legere look alike and Carly say to him, "Sorry, you're too greasy and creepy.  I've found a real man," then go and wrap her arms around big, strapping Marcelo.  His wife might not approve that idea, though.

 

AJ

[Deval]

If you plug in Omaha zip code into T-Mobile's website it literally tells you "Please enter a valid U.S. ZIP Code." Really glad to know we (almost 1 million of us) in the Omaha metro don't exist Mr. Legere.

 

You should tweet that