4/8 Coverage Map Update

[WiWavelength]

They need to find someway to expand someday, roaming as a backup can't go on forever. If thats what a network is reduced to, its not of much use. Even more so in a day of ever growing data use and data speed demands, while Sprint roaming has a 300MB limit as per T&C.

 

No, expansion is not a requirement. As long as the Twin Bells maintain a duopoly, the FCC and DoJ will not allow them to shut out and destroy the rest of the industry. Roaming will continue to be available on fair and reasonable terms.

 

Not to mention, look at T-Mobile. Its national footprint includes large swaths of no coverage because 1) GSM/W-CDMA footprint is inferior to CDMA2000 footprint and 2) T-Mobile and AT&T do not cooperate on unilateral roaming. Yet, T-Mobile still manages to attract tens of millions of users.

 

In the end, for most subs, Sprint's current urban, rural, and highway coverage is sufficient nearly all the time. Roaming is rare; thus, the roaming data quota is rarely an issue. But it really sounds like you are trying to make square peg Sprint fit into the round hole that is what you think a wireless carrier should be. So, have you considered that you might be better off with VZW or AT&T?

 

AJ

[Deval]

Build out a network of their own? Like AT&T and VZW have done over the years, instead of the typical Sprint "Let's just rely on roaming agreements that could fall apart at the Drop of a Pin." I mean I love Sprint, they remind me of Saab as a wireless carrier and I want them to succeed, but they need to own their own extensive network to do that.

 

AT&T and VZW didn't build out their networks, you do know that, right?

 

VZW was created as the bastard love child of Bell Atlantic Mobile, AirTouch, and GTE. Then they made cell babies with Alltel to pick up a huge chunk of native coverage.

 

Both AT&T and Verizon got to their respective sizes through M&A.

 

Sprint, on the other hand, actually built out the network from the ground-up, no real M&A.

[Epic4G25]

Sprint works fine in my local area, but I like having a company that when I need to travel I will be covered. If it wasn't for the fact that Sprint is the only network that fits my needs plan wise I would have left long ago. While I'm here I have a random question, I'm not sure anyone will really have an answer, but I know through NV network backhaul is being upgraded to fiber. My question is what ever happened to the old Sprint coast to coast fiber optic from the LD days? Was it sold off along with the hardwire services to become part of Embarq?

 

Deval - I guess I should have clarified, I don't care if its technically "building out" or simply merging and acquiring new towers, licenses, spectrum, etc from the bought network. Did you actually read the thread? Or just quote the first thing you disagreed with? Yes, I do know Sprint built their network from the ground up "The first all digital, all PCS, nation wide network built from the ground up and reaching over 230 Million people." Trench Coat guy ads always were my favorite. I know their history, because it's been for the most part a history of innovation, it's however been lacking in recent years. Hopefully NV will change that.

[jefbal99]

I've had a problem with Sprint's coverage map since the Alltel debacle a few years back when the "On Network" coverage was reduced by something like 1/3rd over night with no real reason why. As we found out, do to the Alltel/Sprint network share agreement, Sprint was listing Alltel's network as "On Network" and it looked like Sprint Native coverage. When Verizon bought Alltel, just a ton of what was thought to be Sprint's network disappeared.

 

I really wish that Sprint would add a new color to the map for its partners where you are on a different network, but it appears as not roaming.

[Epic4G25]

Yup, that was the first time. Been happening steadily ever since.

[WiWavelength]

While I'm here I have a random question, I'm not sure anyone will really have an answer, but I know through NV network backhaul is being upgraded to fiber. My question is what ever happened to the old Sprint coast to coast fiber optic from the LD days? Was it sold off along with the hardwire services to become part of Embarq?

 

S4GRU has become the preeminent Sprint information site on the Web. If you have a question, one of us can probably answer it.

 

To address your question, Sprint still has its global fiber backbone. And Network Vision 4G cores are located at nodes on that backbone.

 

https://www.sprint.net/network_maps.php

 

AJ

[Epic4G25]

Good to know it's still around, thanks for the info.

[Deval]

Sprint works fine in my local area, but I like having a company that when I need to travel I will be covered. If it wasn't for the fact that Sprint is the only network that fits my needs plan wise I would have left long ago. While I'm here I have a random question, I'm not sure anyone will really have an answer, but I know through NV network backhaul is being upgraded to fiber. My question is what ever happened to the old Sprint coast to coast fiber optic from the LD days? Was it sold off along with the hardwire services to become part of Embarq?

 

Deval - I guess I should have clarified, I don't care if its technically "building out" or simply merging and acquiring new towers, licenses, spectrum, etc from the bought network. Did you actually read the thread? Or just quote the first thing you disagreed with? Yes, I do know Sprint built their network from the ground up "The first all digital, all PCS, nation wide network built from the ground up and reaching over 230 Million people." Trench Coat guy ads always were my favorite. I know their history, because it's been for the most part a history of innovation, it's however been lacking in recent years. Hopefully NV will change that.

 

Sprint still has their fiber, but the extent of the deployment of the wireline network is from Node to Node, not prem/last mile. So for example, here in NYC, all the last mile (to each cell site) is provided by an AAV (Time Warner, Comcast, Level 3) or local telco (Verizon), which then terminates at a meet-me room at the switch. There, the connection hands off to the core MPLS/wireline network.

 

https://www.sprint.net/performance/

 

As for the building out comment, unfortunately the cost for network build-out is so great that is it really worth it? What's the true ROI? Sprint is spending $15b right now (money that we don't even have), to update the network, and that's not counting any new sites.

 

I think the wireless industry has gotten to a point where there is little growth that is organic, so carriers are always considering if something is "worth it" or not, and if the 0.001% fall into that category where it isn't, there won't be growth.

[Fraydog]

The coverage issues didn't pop up overnight. They won't be solved overnight. What Sprint has to do is take a patient approach to foster the right regulatory climate and return to profitability. Then we can start moving on a strategy that can be used to establish more rural coverage. I just don't see much that can be done in the short run.

[jamesinclair]

Basically what was once shown as native coverage, meaning everything worked as if you were on the Sprint network is now off network roaming. Now things will be billed in the effected areas as partner roaming, meaning all calls placed will use Any Time minutes and there is a limit on data roaming.

 

What does that mean for people who are primarilly in those areas?

 

Isnt the rule that 50%+ of your usage must be not roaming or you get kicked out?

[lilotimz]

What does that mean for people who are primarilly in those areas?

 

Isnt the rule that 50%+ of your usage must be not roaming or you get kicked out?

 

IIRC, people who lived in those areas were let go without ETF.

[WiWavelength]

Hold on, folks. Epic has been unable to point out what native coverage has gone missing. I have been looking at Sprint coverage maps for nearly 15 years, and my eyes do not detect any recent omissions. So, I am not convinced that the recent coverage tool update lacks native footprint that was depicted previously. Hence, ETF talk may be irrelevant.

 

AJ

[jamesinclair]

Well the map looks different to me in the mountain area east of Fresno, but that may be a placebo effect.

[WiWavelength]

Any change in pseudo native coverage to roaming coverage would be accompanied by a PRL update, so maybe digiblur can look for any recent changes in that regard.

 

AJ

[digiblur]

Any change in pseudo native coverage to roaming coverage would be accompanied by a PRL update, so maybe digiblur can look for any recent changes in that regard.

 

AJ

 

Only thing that happened lately has been Carolina Wireless got bumped down a priority. I think it is still listed as native coverage though.

 

Sent from my little Note2

 

 

[briankwest]

Reminds me of this....

 

http://support.sprin...:coveragechange

 

Oklahoma lost more coverage back last year when Pioneer went with Verizon and dropped sprint.

[WiWavelength]

Reminds me of this....

 

http://support.sprin...:coveragechange

 

Oklahoma lost more coverage back last year when Pioneer went with Verizon and dropped sprint.

 

The Pioneer betrayal of Sprint was real. The problem here is that we have no solid evidence that any native or pseudo native coverage has been lost.

 

AJ

[briankwest]

This was that Pioneer change from last March.. http://community.sprint.com/baw/thread/85032

 

So coverage that was once native can be lost in short time.

[WiWavelength]

This was that Pioneer change from last March.. http://community.spr...aw/thread/85032

 

So coverage that was once native can be lost in short time.

 

Well, it was pseudo native coverage. Sprint disaggregated and partitioned the spectrum to Pioneer, which also owned the infrastructure. So, Sprint could do basically nothing when Pioneer stabbed Sprint in the back and shacked up with VZW.

 

But that is all well established. In fact, it was the basis of the first article that I wrote for S4GRU last year.

 

http://s4gru.com/ind...t-of-hypocrisy/

 

The issue here is that one member has claimed that, according to a recent Sprint coverage tool update, native coverage has decreased on the West Coast. But that member has been unable to substantiate what native coverage has disappeared. My eyes do not see it. The only problem that I notice is an inaccurately conservative mapping algorithm for the former Ubiquitel affiliate footprint in California's Central Valley. And that problem has shown up previously.

 

So, right now, this situation is a bit like someone yelling, "Fire!" Then, others immediately try to determine the source of the fire. Yet, the fire may not actually exist.

 

AJ

[S4GRU]

I finally got caught up on this thread. AJ and Ryan handled all the points well. I just wanted to add that even though T-Mobile has nearly the same coverage in square mileage as Sprint, if you just look at 3G/4G coverage, Sprint has double the coverage. So much of Tmo coverage is EDGE only, which offers the same performance as Sprint 1x Roaming.

 

For anyone who cares about rural data coverage, Tmo is not an option in most places. Sprint's rural 3G coverage is at least quadruple Tmo. And Sprint's 1x roaming is greater coverage than Tmo EDGE. Tmo is basically good for people who live in urban cities and only occasionally travel through rural areas.

 

Sprint offers us rural customers an opportunity to have a decent 3G experience along rural highways and medium sized rural towns, and roam all other places. This is a good thing for approximately 75% of rural customers, and gives us a choice to not be beholden to the AT&T/Verizon duopoly. I would love for Sprint to expand rural native coverage in the places I go. But I have realistic expectations too.

 

To plan and deploy a brand new site costs around $300-$400k on an existing tower, and can be over a million on a brand new site. Also, operationally, will cost between $20k to $50k. That's a lot of money just to break even in a rural area with few customers. Most rural sites won't recover the costs for an operator like Sprint. It takes a much larger piece of the pie, like 40 percent market share. You can't pull 40 in a new market where you have no presence and no stores. The math just doesn't work out.

 

Sprint closely watches where roaming occurs. If an area starts to receive enough roaming that it pays to build a site, that's what they do. This is the best they can do with the resources it has.

 

What they could do, and something I'd advocate, is to put back 3G roaming. They removed 3G roaming a few years ago. Now with the prevalence of LTE, I think it's time to put back in place EVDO roaming. It would allow a lot of people a better rural off network data experience and maybe keep a few more rural customers from choosing VZW or ATT. Additionally, I would like to see the data roaming cap raised to 500MB (from 300MB now). Or at least have an option to purchase more roaming data for the cost the buy it, plus a reasonable markup.

 

Robert via Nexus 7 with Tapatalk HD

[Fraydog]

Robert, I just keep coming back to the dollars and cents.

 

They just haven't been there since the Nextel merger. It's a minor miracle Sprint is still in business. Hesse saved it from being bankrupt.

[jamesinclair]

Also, operationally, will cost between $20k to $50k.

 

Thats per year...?

[S4GRU]

Thats per year...?

 

Yes, backhaul and power. I think lease payments are on top of this number, though. Which would double the annual amount.

 

Robert

[jamesinclair]

Yes, backhaul and power. I think lease payments are on top of this number, though. Which would double the annual amount.

 

Robert

 

That is significantly higher than I would have expected, wow.

[koiulpoi]

So, wait. $50,000/year (let's not be conservative with our guesses here), at 38,000 sites, is a little under $2 billion. That's... that's really something.