Verizon LTE, I'm impressed

[IamMrFamous07]

So theoretically...can we expect the same speeds with the clearwire spectrum? Or faster?

[ericdabbs]

I'm suggesting they deploy WCS as TD-LTE, and perhaps adding 700 Lower D and E into that depending on testing.

 

That WCS spectrum harmonizes with China Mobile's 2.4 GHz TD-LTE spectrum.

WCS is paired spectrum though.

 

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[Nickel]

WCS is paired spectrum though.

 

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I think only the A and B block are paired, IIRC

[Fraydog]

Yes, use the paired spectrum for FD, and the unpaired for TD.

 

Don't know how that affects Sirius radio, however. That's the hitch.

[Nickel]

Yes, use the paired spectrum for FD, and the unpaired for TD.

 

Don't know how that affects Sirius radio, however. That's the hitch.

Neal's article says that AT&T is using the C and D blocks (which, of course, are the unpaired blocks) as guard bands.

 

http://www.extremetech.com/electronics/131316-att-and-sirius-xm-propose-rules-to-allow-lte-on-wcs

[Fraydog]

Well that shoots that plan down.

[WiWavelength]

Yes, use the paired spectrum for FD, and the unpaired for TD.

 

Don't know how that affects Sirius radio, however. That's the hitch.

Will not fly. The unpaired WCS C and D blocks are being used as de facto guard bands to protect SDARS. Plus, those blocks are only 5 MHz TDD.

 

AJ

[Fraydog]

Will not fly. The unpaired WCS C and D blocks are being used as de facto guard bands to protect SDARS. Plus, those blocks are only 5 MHz TDD.

 

AJ

 

Yes, I figured that out as soon as I started reading Neal's article. 

 

Oh well... 

[Nickel]

Will not fly. The unpaired WCS C and D blocks are being used as de facto guard bands to protect SDARS. Plus, those blocks are only 5 MHz TDD.

 

AJ

You got scooped, AJ. 

 

http://s4gru.com/index.php?/topic/4849-verizon-lte-im-impressed/page-2&do=findComment&comment=220314

 

[ericdabbs]

Sprint should just sell its WCS A and B blocks in the southeast US to AT&T so it makes great use of the spectrum so that AT&T can get a full 10x10 LTE carrier on WCS spectrum.  Sprint is just sitting on it.  I would much rather have them swap some WCS spectrum for PCS spectrum in areas where they need help.

[WiWavelength]

You got scooped, AJ. 

 

http://s4gru.com/index.php?/topic/4849-verizon-lte-im-impressed/page-2&do=findComment&comment=220314

I am lying in bed, typing on a tablet. I got "scooped" while I was still writing.

 

AJ

[Nickel]

I am lying in bed, typing on a tablet. I got "scooped" while I was still writing.

 

AJ

I figured you probably were, I just had to point it out.

 

Sprint should just sell its WCS A and B blocks in the southeast US to AT&T so it makes great use of the spectrum so that AT&T can get a full 10x10 LTE carrier on WCS spectrum.  Sprint is just sitting on it.  I would much rather have them swap some WCS spectrum for PCS spectrum in areas where they need help.

I don't see any way where AT&T gives Sprint any PCS in exchange for the WCS it has, I'd rather AT&T just buy it from them because Sprint is never going to use it and AT&T would.

[Ascertion]

So theoretically...can we expect the same speeds with the clearwire spectrum? Or faster?

Anyone chime in here?  Is Phase 1 Wimax converted sites able to pull these speeds or is it Phase 2 and on?

[lilotimz]

Anyone chime in here?  Is Phase 1 Wimax converted sites able to pull these speeds or is it Phase 2 and on?

 

No. A 20mhz TDD-LTE carrier running in Clearwires setup will top out at ~90 / ~40 due to the continuous blocked split up in a 3:2 fashion. Going for 18 mhz of usable spectrum as very simple estimates for guard bands.. that gives us 11-12 mhz for DL and 5-7 mhz fo UL. 

 

A 20mhz TDD carrier is slightly superior to a 10x10 FDD carrier on the downlink and somewhat inferior on the uplink. To match a 20x20 FDD setup you need 40mhz TDD carriers or 20+20 CA'd TDD carriers. 

 

But that's no issue as Sprint has at least 40-50 mhz of BRS spectrum and a hodgepodge of EBS spectrum meaning Sprint can deploy additional 20 mhz TD carriers as needed in the future to keep speeds stable. T-Mobile, Verizon, and ATT will need to refarm other spectrum if their 20mhz carriers start bogging down. 

 

[Nickel]

No. A 20mhz TDD-LTE carrier running in Clearwires setup will top out at ~90 / ~40 due to the continuous blocked split up in a 3:2 fashion. Going for 18 mhz of usable spectrum as very simple estimates for guard bands.. that gives us 11-12 mhz for DL and 5-7 mhz fo UL. 

 

A 20mhz TDD carrier is slightly superior to a 10x10 FDD carrier on the downlink and somewhat inferior on the uplink. To match a 20x20 FDD setup you need 40mhz TDD carriers or 20+20 CA'd TDD carriers. 

 

But that's no issue as Sprint has at least 40-50 mhz of BRS spectrum and a hodgepodge of EBS spectrum meaning Sprint can deploy additional 20 mhz TD carriers as needed in the future to keep speeds stable. T-Mobile, Verizon, and ATT will need to refarm other spectrum if their 20mhz carriers start bogging down. 

I thought the most you could use was 20+20 with CA?

[ericdabbs]

I thought the most you could use was 20+20 with CA?

 

According to Qualcomm, LTE-A with CA can combine multiple LTE carriers of up to 100 MHz (ex: 20+20+20+20+20) to create one big fat huge pipe.  However no wireless carrier has that much free spectrum to spare nor has the power output needed to do this though.  Going past 20+20 with CA shouldn't be an issue.

[gnoj]

According to Qualcomm, LTE-A with CA can combine multiple LTE carriers of up to 100 MHz (ex: 20+20+20+20+20) to create one big fat huge pipe.  However no wireless carrier has that much free spectrum to spare nor has the power output needed to do this though.  Going past 20+20 with CA shouldn't be an issue.

 

I think he was referring to the new RRUs. They can be configured for 20, 40, or 20+20 MHz.

[Nickel]

According to Qualcomm, LTE-A with CA can combine multiple LTE carriers of up to 100 MHz (ex: 20+20+20+20+20) to create one big fat huge pipe.  However no wireless carrier has that much free spectrum to spare nor has the power output needed to do this though.  Going past 20+20 with CA shouldn't be an issue.

Oh, Neat.

 

I think he was referring to the new RRUs. They can be configured for 20, 40, or 20+20 MHz.

That wasn't directly what I was talking about that but maybe that's what I was thinking of.

[Deval]

So that's Verizon's AWS 20x20 FDD, to supplement their 700mhz 10x10 FDD, impressive. Very impressive. 

[Paynefanbro]

So that's Verizon's AWS 20x20 FDD, to supplement their 700mhz 10x10 FDD, impressive. Very impressive. 

 

Not so impressive if they're deploying on every third site like they did with 700Mhz. Hopefully, this time around they'll actually densely deploy.

[Deval]

Not so impressive if they're deploying on every third site like they did with 700Mhz. Hopefully, this time around they'll actually densely deploy.

 

Considering Verizon's original spacing was for 1900, deploying 700mhz on every third site is fine for overlay. AWS will require using the same dense PCS spacing they have in effect now. So that should be fine, in fact, should be pretty seamless.

 

I gotta hand it to them, very good business and service.

[S4GRU]

Verizon needs AWS in Rapid City. 1/3 of their LTE 750 sites drop to 1-2Mbps in the evenings. Another third drop to 2-4Mbps, and the final third are over 4. I do get between 30-40Mbps from Midnight to 5 AM though.

 

Robert via Samsung Note 8.0 using Tapatalk Pro

[z250kid]

11/01/2012 is my first documented ticket on the current issue for the site.  It's still broke as of today.  Between me and another member we've probably opened about 30-40 tickets this year on the site.  They let my co-worker out of his contract with his brand new 5 lines and phones scott free over the site.  I've gotten probably $300+ in credits over the site.  Opened another ticket today to start the process for more credits and cover my butt for going over my 300meg roaming due to this site.  Seems like it would be easier to fix and provide the customers in the downtown area with a working data connection. 

Since last year on my tower I use to be constant 4 bars now one bar.  I called for 3 months straight due to roaming to find out they upgraded the the tower to a gmo site now I get one bar -109db.   I'm tired of hearing theirs a ticket opened and we will call you they never do.  I only had one person that called me back.

[WiWavelength]

Verizon needs AWS in Rapid City. 1/3 of their LTE 750 sites drop to 1-2Mbps in the evenings. Another third drop to 2-4Mbps, and the final third are over 4. I do get between 30-40Mbps from Midnight to 5 AM though.

 

Have you gone spotting yet and made a tally of how many VZW sites are in the city limits and then how many of those have been overlaid with LTE?

 

AJ

[Stevero]

Next month my Verizon contract is up so it's decision time.

I was hopeful of ditching dual service and going only with Sprint to save money.

Unfortunately Sprint just isn't good enough yet, an LTE/800MHz voice tower (SE 44th & Sooner Rd. in Del City) just a mile away from my gym is unusable inside.  Verizon works well. 

Since the mobile isn't allowed in the office it's real important to me that I catch up on things while in the gym during lunch.

Maybe 800 MHz LTE (which we should get in a couple of years?) will help and I can kick the Verizon habit.