Dish Network/Boost Mobile cell/5G buildout thread

[dkyeager]

Note the band locking works and the actual bands.

 

[dkyeager]

Concerns on costs of T-Mobile and AT&T Roaming. Note that he is planning on being a competitor.

https://twitter.com/peter_adderton/status/1641511803086848003?t=JR2FM0rT068A_M3FXrtlDQ&s=19

[Trip]

1 hour ago, dkyeager said:

Note the band locking works and the actual bands.

 

I really wish this wasn't still so shrouded in mystery.  I see these phones available new on eBay (Boost locked, but again, I don't care) for $99, and would love to buy one of those and activate a Rainbow SIM on the $100/year plan, and I can't find a good answer on whether or not that is something that can be done, even if I drove down to Richmond to try to do it.  Don't really want to be out the $100 if they won't let me do it.

- Trip

[red_dog007]

3 hours ago, dkyeager said:

Concerns on costs of T-Mobile and AT&T Roaming. Note that he is planning on being a competitor.

https://twitter.com/peter_adderton/status/1641511803086848003?t=JR2FM0rT068A_M3FXrtlDQ&s=19

Bit too early to tell imo. It's good news if Dish can stop the hemorrhaging. Q3/Q4 2022 they were able to stop the hemorrhaging. Their previous 6 quarters they lost between 160k and 350k subs each. Their next report will be interesting to see how they were impacted subscriber wise due to the hack.

[dkyeager]

I ordered an A23 online and it came with the AT&T sim (not the rainbow sim as expected) So I have RMAed it.

[iansltx]

Seems like Dish is slowly dialing things in in some markets; Albuquerque indoor coverage seems to be improved at 170+ Mbps down, 15 Mbps up on my Netgear.

I also saw 313-340 in Austin last night/this morning, so maybe when I'm back in a week it'll actually be live. As it stands, roaming service in Austin on T-Mobile is excellent; I hit 600 Mbps down, 100 Mbps up last night (my S22 exceeded 800 Mbps in the same spot, but 600 ain't shabby).

[iansltx]

Posting this connected to DishNet in Austin. n66 SDL is definitely working hear, as I'm seeing speeds above 100 Mbps. n71 is 10x10 so uploads are getting close to 30 Mbps (of course they do...I'm probably the only one on the network).

Having to SSH tunnel to my Google Fiber connection to get reliable connectivity for the normal DishNet reasons...direct connectivity is a bit shaky. Looks like sites closer to downtown don't exist yet, as I've dropped to n71 on the way back from the airport. But I'm pretty sure there's a site closer to where I live, so I'll be able to test from a stationary location later this evening.

[red_dog007]

Any word on when Genesis will go out of beta?  I am considering getting the mobile hotspot but don't need it for another month or two.

[dkyeager]

It appears Dish is turning back in 12  600hz licenses it leased to T-Mobile.  Not certain why they just don't keep leasing them.

[red_dog007]

So Dish won't own those licenses? Does Dish get their money back? Seems like they'd just sell them, no? Maybe raising funds to aquire the 800MHz?

Or they are just cancelling the lease?

 

[dkyeager]

16 minutes ago, red_dog007 said:

So Dish won't own those licenses? Does Dish get their money back? Seems like they'd just sell them, no? Maybe raising funds to aquire the 800MHz?

Or they are just cancelling the lease?

 

The reddit thread goes through this. Prevented from selling to any national carrier.

[iansltx]

On 5/2/2023 at 8:05 PM, red_dog007 said:

Any word on when Genesis will go out of beta?  I am considering getting the mobile hotspot but don't need it for another month or two.

Why would you wait for "out of beta"? The network isn't gonna magically get better by removing the label heh

[red_dog007]

30 minutes ago, iansltx said:

Why would you wait for "out of beta"? The network isn't gonna magically get better by removing the label heh

That's not it.  Once out of beta, thinking plans are going to change up a bit.  Want to get in before that.

[dkyeager]

21 hours ago, iansltx said:

Why would you wait for "out of beta"? The network isn't gonna magically get better by removing the label heh

n70 phones, possibly lower priced plans.

[dkyeager]

https://www.lightreading.com/5g-and-beyond/dish-meddles-with-t-mobiles-$35b-deal-for-600mhz-spectrum/d/d-id/784724?

"Clerical error".  meant to cancel the leases to T-Mobile.

Dish is also challenging T-Mobile's spectrum holdings where it has over 1/3 of the available spectrum in any market (127 markets), specifically focusing on the 64 markets with 20MHz or more.

I wonder if this includes T-Mobile's 800MHz holdings, which Dish has the option to buy.  I smell an attempt to lower the price by Dish in one way or another.

[RedSpark]

Dish is still bleeding out: https://www.fiercewireless.com/wireless/dish-loses-81000-wireless-customers-q1

Dish Network lost about 81,000 wireless net subscribers in the first quarter of 2023 compared to a net loss of 343,000 in the year-ago quarter.

It's "Sprint" all over again.

[dkyeager]

6 hours ago, RedSpark said:

Dish is still bleeding out: https://www.fiercewireless.com/wireless/dish-loses-81000-wireless-customers-q1

Dish Network lost about 81,000 wireless net subscribers in the first quarter of 2023 compared to a net loss of 343,000 in the year-ago quarter.

It's "Sprint" all over again.

Their systems were actually getting better. Unknownledgeable store clerks were the issue (and customer support if you had a problem).  Then their systems were hacked (ransomware).  Wonder if they had good insurance?

[dkyeager]

https://www.lightreading.com/open-ran/dish-pledges-to-slow-5g-network-spending-this-year/d/d-id/784758?

Confirms many of our thoughts. 

 

[RedSpark]

1 hour ago, dkyeager said:

Their systems were actually getting better. Unknownledgeable store clerks were the issue (and customer support if you had a problem).  Then their systems were hacked (ransomware).  Wonder if they had good insurance?

Good points here.

Here's the summary/aftermath of Dish's Earnings Call today: https://www.fiercewireless.com/wireless/dish-updates-liquidity-situation-5g-build-800-mhz

[iansltx]

Welp, grabbed the Moto Edge 2022 because it actually has all Dish NR bands, and while it can connect to the network and definitely sees n70 (and n71), it won't actually pass traffic, and eventually falls off the network.

I'll probably keep the phone until toward the end of the return period to see if I can get anything sorted out on it.

[Trip]

Out of curiosity:

1) What did you spend on it?

2) How were you connecting it?  Boost Rainbow SIM on a service plan, or something else?

I'm still trying to work out how to track the Dish wireless network and it's being a real pain.

- Trip

[iansltx]

5 hours ago, Trip said:

Out of curiosity:

1) What did you spend on it?

2) How were you connecting it?  Boost Rainbow SIM on a service plan, or something else?

I'm still trying to work out how to track the Dish wireless network and it's being a real pain.

- Trip

1. $350+tax, minus some Amazon gift card and credit card points that I had. Since it's unlocked, I can pop in my Boost/AT&T SIM and that one actually works fine (incl. n5 and n77).

2. Project Genesis Rainbow SIM (which normally sits in my M6 Pro). If I throw the SIM in my S22 it works on roaming; it locks to the XAA CSC there, which doesn't include and SA NR bands. Apparently I can avoid the CSC switch by doing some finagling with adb, but I don't exactly get any new info if I go that route, as I already know n71 and n66 SDL are live here from my experiences on my M6 Pro, so the only thing I gain is being able to map (which I might do in a few weeks anyway).

The Edge 2022 definitely works well enough to throw at Cellmapper at this point. You just won't be able to actually pass traffic with the rainbow SIM, it seems. Maybe once they have VoNR live here that changes.

[RedSpark]

More bad news on top of the wireless sub losses for Dish:

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/dish-network-suffers-major-subscriber-102155011.html

Quote

Dish Network's revenue decline was primarily due to a drop in revenue from its Pay-TV Wireless and Wireless segments. The company's net pay TV subscribers fell by 552,000 in Q1 compared to a net decline of 462,000 in Q1 FY22. Retail wireless net subscribers decreased by 81,000 in Q1 FY23 compared to a net decrease of 343,000 in Q1 FY22. Operating income declined to $323.4 million, down from $550.4 million a year ago, while earnings per share (EPS) of $0.35 missed the consensus estimate of $0.36.

This isn't going well.

https://www.lightreading.com/open-ran/dish-pledges-to-slow-5g-network-spending-this-year/d/d-id/784758

Quote

Dish Network officials expressed confidence that the company will meet its government-mandated 5G network buildout requirements by June and suggested the company might take a breather after that.

"We certainly will be able to take a little bit of a pause" in capital expenses (capex) after June, said Dish Chairman Charlie Ergen Monday during the company's quarterly conference call.

Not a good idea to pause on a network buildout. Of course, Dish wouldn't have to do this if it had the money to keep building. Reminds me of Sprint choosing not to participate in the 600 MHz Auction and lying about why it didn't until it had to come clean in an FCC disclosure.

[Trip]

Do you happen to have a link for how to disable the CSC switch when you put a SIM in?  I haven't successfully found any steps for that, and not for lack of searching.  I must be using the wrong search terms or something.  I really need to stop one of my devices from doing that.

I'm just looking to map stuff, but without spending a bunch of money on a monthly service plan.  The most I spend on any given "mapping device" is $10/mo for US Cellular, which I only have to put money on when I'm actually using it.  The rest are $5/mo or less (some are free).  I'd love to get the Boost $100/year plan but I hear that one can't be activated on the Rainbow SIM.  Very frustrating.

I'm hoping that if I can somehow get my hands on an unactivated Rainbow SIM, that will make it possible to map.  Problem, at this point, is actually getting one of those.

- Trip

[dkyeager]

https://www.fiercewireless.com/5g/dish-will-expand-vonr-throughout-network-later-year

https://www.lightreading.com/open-ran/dishs-pause-looms-over-cell-tower-industry/d/d-id/784799?

Basically, it looks like Dish is running out of cash.  VoNR increased coverage is essential to better utilization of their new network, thus hopefully improving cash flow. The 2025 buildout deadline basically requires them to double their number of tower sites.  Still see the 800 MHz as an opportunity not to be missed, at least in the areas they plan to cover.  IMO they need a partner/merger with a new cellular player to the US market.