Holy frac...T-Mobile family plan for 4 lines down to $100/month

[travismheim]

Talked to a rep yesterday about a 5th line.  They said line 5 would be the same as normal now $10.  $110 for 12.5 GB is great, only problem is it's shared, but they got music freedom which is pretty nice if you are in an area where T-mobile works.   Still waiting for sprint to roll out LTE here, everyone else has it.  Was going to test drive sprint again but the whole up to 90 days for a refund in their terms is a big turn off. 

I doubt it would take anywhere near 90 days to receive a refund if you decide to cancel service.

[WiWavelength]

...but they got music freedom which is pretty nice if you are in an area where T-mobile works.

 

Yeah, it is "pretty nice" -- if you are a young person who knows too little or cares too little about Net neutrality.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Net_neutrality

http://www.fiercewireless.com/story/t-mobiles-music-freedom-may-tread-net-neutralitys-territory/2014-06-19

http://www.theverge.com/2014/6/18/5822996/t-mobile-music-freedom-net-neutrality

http://bgr.com/2014/06/19/t-mobile-music-freedom-net-neutrality/

 

AJ

[spotmeterf64]

Talked to a rep yesterday about a 5th line.  They said line 5 would be the same as normal now $10.  $110 for 12.5 GB is great, only problem is it's shared, but they got music freedom which is pretty nice if you are in an area where T-mobile works.   Still waiting for sprint to roll out LTE here, everyone else has it.  Was going to test drive sprint again but the whole up to 90 days for a refund in their terms is a big turn off. 

 

90 days is CYA Language. In general, refunds are issued and show on bank/credit card statements in 3-5 business days. However, some banks and some credit card issuers prefer to wait for 2-3 billing cycles (hence the 90 days). This is rare, but it does happen. To me, this has more to do with your specific financial institution's practices than Sprint's.

 

Also, if you make your payments for the device/service in cash (or debit with PIN rather than signature) it may take several weeks for the home office finace office to issue a check for the refund. Still not 90 days probably.

Edited July 30, 2014 by spotmeterf64

[Rawvega]

Still waiting for sprint to roll out LTE here, everyone else has it.  

 

Where is "here"?

[SquirtleSquad]

Where is "here"?

Northern California 

[Rawvega]

Gracias.

 

Sent from my SM-N900P using Tapatalk

[caspar347]

Analysts fear that this plan will cut T-Mobile's ARPU even further down. They also suspect that this might force Verizon to react to T-Mobile. http://www.fiercewireless.com/story/analysts-t-mobiles-family-plan-promo-could-cut-arpu-might-pressure-verizon/2014-07-29

How the hell is their ARPU still positive?!

[WiWavelength]

How the hell is their ARPU still positive?!

 

Arpu always stays positive, looks on the bright side.

 

 

AJ

[JimBob]

How the hell is their ARPU still positive?!

Revenue is sales, ie the money coming in regardless of what goes out.

[caspar347]

Revenue is sales, ie the money coming in regardless of what goes out.

Ahh. Derp. Is AnIPU still positive? lol

[Mr.Nuke]

How the hell is their ARPU still positive?!

Just to make this more explicit than what JimBob said (his description was accurate). APRU stands for Average Revenue Per Unit. In wireless industry terms, this is the amount of money the average user of a company spends per month per month on the service. Revenue is solely what the customer is paying.Thus unless a company is giving away services for free, ARPU is always going to be positive. In accounting terms Revenue or sales is the top line item, it doesn't include any expenses the company bears to generate the revenue. 

----------------

And this is one of those financial analyst duh moments... If T-Mobile gains additional subscribers via a plan with a monthly cost less than their current ARPU, their ARPU will drop...

[WiWavelength]

And this is one of those financial analyst duh moments... If T-Mobile gains additional subscribers via a plan with a monthly cost less than their current ARPU, their ARPU will drop...

 

No, no, please say Arpu will not drop...

 

 

AJ

[Mr.Nuke]

No, no, please say Arpu will not drop...

-Seth

[centermedic]

What? Why would they do that?

Just comparing. If I read it right T-Mo's new plan is shared data while Framily is not. That's a plus.

[Paynefanbro]

Just comparing. If I read it right T-Mo's new plan is shared data while Framily is not. That's a plus.

Nope. It's not shared data, it's 4 separate lines with 2.5GB each. It goes down to 1GB per person after a certain time though.

[S4GRU]

I couldn't live with 2.5GB of data, let alone 1GB.

 

Robert via Samsung Note 8.0 using Tapatalk Pro

[JeffDTD]

Right. Once the promo expires,based on current tmo plans, the 4 line option would be 3gb per line for $140.

The promo sounds like max framily pricing for 4 instead of 7 with an extra 1.5GB thrown in. Sprint could easily offer to waive the $10 fee for 3GB per line and trounce this. They could also adjust framily pricing. If the majority of framilies are hitting their 7 line pricing, the arpu risk posed by lowering the max discount requirements is minimal.

 

Sent from my VS980 4G using Tapatalk

[irev210]

I am not sure why people on this forum care about wireless margins.

 

If anyone says "because that will lead to a faster/better network" I will quickly point to AT&T as a leading example of where profits go.

 

As far as I am concerned, people should be thrilled that T-Mobile is kicking up some dust on how to price out plans.

 

The fact that Hesse is talking about changing plan pricing (yet again) is encouraging.

 

It's competition guys.  We want the fastest data, best coverage, best call quality, all at the lowest price.

[JimBob]

I am not sure why people on this forum care about wireless margins.

 

If anyone says "because that will lead to a faster/better network" I will quickly point to AT&T as a leading example of where profits go.

 

As far as I am concerned, people should be thrilled that T-Mobile is kicking up some dust on how to price out plans.

 

The fact that Hesse is talking about changing plan pricing (yet again) is encouraging.

 

It's competition guys.  We want the fastest data, best coverage, best call quality, all at the lowest price.

No margin (profit)  = competition disappears (bankruptcy, consolidation, retrenchment, etc.)

 

That's (market) economics. So we should "care". Low prices are great, but they ultimately need to be sustainable and successful (profitable) for the companies to continue to offer them.

[irev210]

No margin (profit)  = competition disappears (bankruptcy, consolidation, retrenchment, etc.)

 

That's (market) economics. So we should "care". Low prices are great, but they ultimately need to be sustainable and successful (profitable) for the companies to continue to offer them.

 

 

That's all well and good but given the current industry gross margins, none are in danger of not making enough "profit".

 

Do you really think that T-Mobile's pricing strategy is them attempting to drive themselves into bankruptcy?

 

What's wrong with a 10% operating margin?  Why does VZ need a 63% gross margin and a 26.5% operating margin?  Why does ATT need a 60% gross margin and a 23.67% operating margin?

 

That's my view, as a customer.

 

Sure if I was a stockholder in VZ or T, I would want highest return possible.

 

If I was a S stockholder, i would want them to buy TMUS all day long.

 

But as a customer - no way.  I'll take lower margins, more competition, better pricing.

 

None of them are going bankrupt.

[bigsnake49]

I am not sure why people on this forum care about wireless margins.

 

If anyone says "because that will lead to a faster/better network" I will quickly point to AT&T as a leading example of where profits go.

 

As far as I am concerned, people should be thrilled that T-Mobile is kicking up some dust on how to price out plans.

 

The fact that Hesse is talking about changing plan pricing (yet again) is encouraging.

 

It's competition guys.  We want the fastest data, best coverage, best call quality, all at the lowest price.

 

Sprint and T-Mobile are not AT&T. They cannot spread their capex over 100M people. They don't have ooddles of low frequency spectrum. So margins matter. Or you think that T-Mobile is doing this to please you and give you the consumer cheaper prices. They are doing this because DT wants out of the market. Whether it is Sprint or Dish or somebody else they want out. They want out because they know they cannot compete with the big two.

Edited July 30, 2014 by bigsnake49

[JimBob]

That's all well and good but given the current industry gross margins, none are in danger of not making enough "profit".

 

Do you really think that T-Mobile's pricing strategy is them attempting to drive themselves into bankruptcy?

 

What's wrong with a 10% operating margin?  Why does VZ need a 63% gross margin and a 26.5% operating margin?  Why does ATT need a 60% gross margin and a 23.67% operating margin?

 

That's my view, as a customer.

 

Sure if I was a stockholder in VZ or T, I would want highest return possible.

 

If I was a S stockholder, i would want them to buy TMUS all day long.

 

But as a customer - no way.  I'll take lower margins, more competition, better pricing.

 

None of them are going bankrupt.

I am not worried about AT&T and Verizon.

 

Sprint has $33 billion in debt; T-Mobile has $14 billion in debt. Sprint lost almost $2 billion last year while T-Mobile barely broke even. The two little companies are still only around because they respectively got bailed out by SoftBank and Deutsche Telekom (via AT&T breakup fee).

[irev210]

 

Sprint and T-Mobile are not AT&T. They cannot spread their capex over 100M people. They don't have ooddles of low frequency spectrum. So margins matter. Or you think that T-Mobile is doing this to please you and give you the consumer cheaper prices. They are doing this because DT wants out of the market. Whether it is Sprint or Dish or somebody else they want out. They want out because they know they cannot compete with the big two.

 

 

They cannot spread their capex over 100MM people (and maintain the same wireless margins that VZ and T have*).

 

I think that T-Mobile wants to gain market share and say "yeah, we'll make less per customer but ultimately,we'll have more customers, so overall we will make more in the long-term."

 

 

I am not worried about AT&T and Verizon.

 

Sprint has $33 billion in debt; T-Mobile has $14 billion in debt. Sprint lost almost $2 billion last year while T-Mobile barely broke even. The two little companies are still only around because they respectively got bailed out by SoftBank and Deutsche Telekom (via AT&T breakup fee).

 

What is wrong with 33 billion in debt?  What is wrong with 14 billion in debt?  AT&T has 75 billion in debt.  Verizon has 94 billion in debt.

 

The little two companies are only around because they are highly attractive assets worth billions.  It's not charity - nobody "bailed out" T-Mobile or Sprint.  Softbank looks at Sprint as an investment, not charity care.

 

T-Mobile had 35 million in net income after 4 billion in capital expenditures.  T-Mobile spent more on capital in 2013 than the last three years COMBINED.

 

Sprint's issues are well documented and well compounded - took many years to "right the ship" and we've already started to see margin expansion even with customer losses.

 

It's not that these two entities can't be stand alone - they would be more profitable as combined entities, sure.  But in no way would they not be self-supporting on their own.

 

As a customer, I'll take them on their own and take the cheaper prices.  Again, as a stockholder, I would take them as a combined entity.

[bigsnake49]

I am not worried about AT&T and Verizon.

 

Sprint has $33 billion in debt; T-Mobile has $14 billion in debt. Sprint lost almost $2 billion last year while T-Mobile barely broke even. The two little companies are still only around because they respectively got bailed out by SoftBank and Deutsche Telekom (via AT&T breakup fee).

Actually T-Mobile has $20B in debt

[irev210]

Actually T-Mobile has $20B in debt

 

1,000,000 6,759 493,241 1,250,000 1,250,000 1,000,000 1,750,000 1,250,000 1,000,000 1,250,000 5,925 1,744,075 600,000 1,000,000

 

Total Debt 13,600

Total Issues 15