Network Vision/LTE - West Washington Market (Seattle/Puget Sound Region)

[PedroDaGr8]

11 hours ago, RAvirani said:

Great news and long overdue!

Yes, really about damn time. Verizon has already rolled out mmWave through out all of DT Kirkland (and what looks like maybe C-Band in a couple places).

[RAvirani]

2 minutes ago, PedroDaGr8 said:

Yes, really about damn time. Verizon has already rolled out mmWave through out all of DT Kirkland (and what looks like maybe C-Band in a couple places).

Yeah - Verizon has got a lot of mmWave small cells in that area.

That being said, they still have the poorest indoor coverage since they’ve only got one macro at the marina (SEA Moss Bay). SEA Feriton (on 6th by the Google campus) helps, but not a ton. 

[PedroDaGr8]

On 4/8/2021 at 11:04 AM, PedroDaGr8 said:

Looks like they changed their mind. That or they are just covering all of their bases:

Permit ID: BLD21040
Application Date: 04/08/2021
Project Address: 14125 NE 189TH ST B
Project Name: 880310 Sprint/TMO Installation
Project Description: T-Mobile to remove existing platform and equipment and extend tower 20', install new platform mount with (6) antennas, (6) radios, (1) MW, (2) lines, relocate (1) replace (1) cabinet in existing compound.

 

Interesting that they intend to make that tower 20 feet taller. It seems that would make the cross-talk worse, unless they intend to not populate the direction pointing towards town. 

Was at my companies site in the Warehouse district today when my Sprint signal cutoff. I get zero T-Mobile signal in the lab so it was very obvious. Anyways, when I left work, I drove by the Warehouse district tower and it was decapitated:

https://imgur.com/a/rpX07lU

Also, the Sprint site down by the Woodinville Slough (SE35XC004) has been fully converted but isn't live yet. Not a trace of Sprint on the site anymore from what I can see. 

[RAvirani]

4 hours ago, PedroDaGr8 said:

Was at my companies site in the Warehouse district today when my Sprint signal cutoff. I get zero T-Mobile signal in the lab so it was very obvious. Anyways, when I left work, I drove by the Warehouse district tower and it was decapitated:

https://imgur.com/a/rpX07lU

Also, the Sprint site down by the Woodinville Slough (SE35XC004) has been fully converted but isn't live yet. Not a trace of Sprint on the site anymore from what I can see. 

Ooh - good progress! I’m interested to see what the azimuths are for the Woodinville warehouse district tower. 

What equipment is on the Valley Industrial site?

[PedroDaGr8]

8 hours ago, RAvirani said:

Ooh - good progress! I’m interested to see what the azimuths are for the Woodinville warehouse district tower. 

What equipment is on the Valley Industrial site?

I will try to get some pictures later today but per the permit:

310599 National Glass SE02023A
T-MOBILE PROPOSES TO COLLOCATE ON AN EXISTING UNMANNED TELECOMMUNICATIONS FACILITY AS FOLLOWS: TOWER SCOPE OF WORK: REMOVE SPRINT ANTENNAS, RRU'S, FILTERS, MOUNT KIT, & CABLES. INSTALL A PLATFORM MOUNT W/ HANDRAIL KIT. INSTALL (3) FFVV-65C-R3-V1 & (3) AEHC PANEL ANTENNAS. INSTALL (3) AHLOA & (3) AHFIG RRU'S. INSTALL (2) HCS 2.0 PENDANT STYLE HYBRID CABLES GROUND SCOPE OF WORK: REMOVE SPRINT EQUIPMENT CABINETS, GPS ANTENNA, & UTILITY H-FRAME W/ TELCO BOX, METER, & PPC. INSTALL A 6'-0"x10'-0" ICE CANOPY. INSTALL (1) HPL3 BATTERY CABINET W/ (4) STRINGS OF BATTERIES & (1) HPL3 POWER CABINET W/ (2) AMIA, (2) ASIB, (3) ABIA, (3) ABIC, (2) ASIK, (4) ABIL, (1) FSMF, (1) CSR IXRe V1 ROUTER, (1) VOLTAGE BOOSTER W/ (2) AMPLIFIERS, & (1) EXTRA AMPLIFIER ? INSTALL (1) 25 kW DIESEL GENERATOR ? INSTALL (1) GPS ANTENNA, (2) HCS 2.0 JUNCTION BOXES, & (1) H-FRAME W/ TELCO BOX, TECH LIGHT W/ TIMER, PPC, DISCONNECT, & 200A METER

[PedroDaGr8]

It is apparently cell tower week in Woodinville as Verizon has joined in on the fun, upgrading their DT Woodinville site.

 

As of today, they have increased the height of the Warehouse district tower in about about jankiest way possible, by bolting an extension to the top. I'm sure it is structurally sound but it sure looks cheap at this stage: 

The National Glass site is still not live as it is still being worked on. The workers were still there, as evidenced by the safety cables still hanging from the rack. Here is the equipment installed: 

The last is a couple images of the Verizon work:

[RAvirani]

10 hours ago, PedroDaGr8 said:

It is apparently cell tower week in Woodinville as Verizon has joined in on the fun, upgrading their DT Woodinville site.

That’s likely because Verizon is colocating onto the T-Mobile/Clearwire downtown site.

10 hours ago, PedroDaGr8 said:

As of today, they have increased the height of the Warehouse district tower in about about jankiest way possible, by bolting an extension to the top. I'm sure it is structurally sound but it sure looks cheap at this stage: 

 

 

This is actually pretty standard for height increases but I agree - it does look a bit funny.

[PedroDaGr8]

10 hours ago, RAvirani said:

That’s likely because Verizon is colocating onto the T-Mobile/Clearwire downtown site.

Are you sure about that? When I drove by this morning, it looks like they are done on the tower. They have basically installed all new  antennas on that tower and even added three Ericsson 6488 n48 CBRS panel. Seems strange to so that upgrade now is they will just be moving in the not too distant future.

[RAvirani]

1 hour ago, PedroDaGr8 said:

Are you sure about that? When I drove by this morning, it looks like they are done on the tower. They have basically installed all new  antennas on that tower and even added three Ericsson 6488 n48 CBRS panel. Seems strange to so that upgrade now is they will just be moving in the not too distant future.

Oh no - they will be keeping both locations.

Azimuths on the existing Verizon tower needed to be adjusted to keep the noise floor low, since the T-Mobile tower is relatively close by. That Verizon tower was also way overdue for 4x MIMO and highband given the demand for data in that area. 

[PedroDaGr8]

T-Mobile has been busy! The Sprint Keep site by the 405/522 intersection (eNB 745951) has also been converted in the past week or so.  None of the convert sites are live yet but two new b41 sites went live today.  I haven't located them yet but I think I know which ones they are.

 

[RAvirani]

Looks like the old CC and ATC towers at the end of 520 in Redmond are gone. There’s a new tower very close to the old ATC location with all three carriers. 

[RAvirani]

On 11/11/2021 at 2:40 PM, PedroDaGr8 said:

It is apparently cell tower week in Woodinville as Verizon has joined in on the fun, upgrading their DT Woodinville site.

I stopped by this site and was surprised to see that they disabled lowband carrier aggregation after the upgrade (midband was moved to the 300,000 offset eNB). I thought that site’s lowband and midband footprints almost entirely overlapped. 

I wonder if they’re anticipating increased lowband load from n5 usage…

[PedroDaGr8]

On 11/29/2021 at 10:21 AM, RAvirani said:

I stopped by this site and was surprised to see that they disabled lowband carrier aggregation after the upgrade (midband was moved to the 300,000 offset eNB). I thought that site’s lowband and midband footprints almost entirely overlapped. 

I wonder if they’re anticipating increased lowband load from n5 usage…

I wouldn't be surprised if they intend to do similar to TMo with the low-band (b71 in TMos case) being the primary carrier and mid-band providing the high data throughout (n41 for TMo). 

The warehouse district site is complete. I snapped some pics of the work in progress last week. Weather hasn't complied with snapping a final finished shot. 

None of the conversion sites I have come across are live yet. I have no idea why because they are all 100% complete. Hope it's soon because a bunch of coworkers who are T-Mobile customers have been complaining about how bad the signal has gotten recently. It's essentially non-existent at the back of our Woodinville location.

 

[xmx1024]

On 12/2/2021 at 10:55 AM, PedroDaGr8 said:

I wouldn't be surprised if they intend to do similar to TMo with the low-band (b71 in TMos case) being the primary carrier and mid-band providing the high data throughout (n41 for TMo). 

The warehouse district site is complete. I snapped some pics of the work in progress last week. Weather hasn't complied with snapping a final finished shot. 

None of the conversion sites I have come across are live yet. I have no idea why because they are all 100% complete. Hope it's soon because a bunch of coworkers who are T-Mobile customers have been complaining about how bad the signal has gotten recently. It's essentially non-existent at the back of our Woodinville location.

 

I have heard this a lot about the SEA market - I moved away in January, but been hearing conversion sites are not online yet. Seriously wonder why. I cannot think of a reason myself. @RAvirani I saw earlier in the thread you had a email thread going on with someone at T-Mobile? Probably the regional network manager? Might you reach out to him?

[RAvirani]

58 minutes ago, xmx1024 said:

I have heard this a lot about the SEA market - I moved away in January, but been hearing conversion sites are not online yet. Seriously wonder why. I cannot think of a reason myself. @RAvirani I saw earlier in the thread you had a email thread going on with someone at T-Mobile? Probably the regional network manager? Might you reach out to him?

There’s a good bit of complexity to bringing sites online, even conversions.

Integration/etc takes time because they don’t just affect the conversion site, but every site around said conversion. Surrounding sites’ electrical downtilts need to be edited, handoff parameters need to be optimized, CA needs to be configured, neighbor lists have to be updated, PCIs/PRACH RSIs need to be carefully chosen, etc; and that’s barely scratching the surface. 

[xmx1024]

2 hours ago, RAvirani said:

There’s a good bit of complexity to bringing sites online, even conversions.

Integration/etc takes time because they don’t just affect the conversion site, but every site around said conversion. Surrounding sites’ electrical downtilts need to be edited, handoff parameters need to be optimized, CA needs to be configured, neighbor lists have to be updated, PCIs/PRACH RSIs need to be carefully chosen, etc; and that’s barely scratching the surface. 

Fair, and that can be tough in a more urban environment. All the conversion sites in my area in southern AZ were online within a week, and it seems all (if not most) in WA have not been turned on, even after multiple months.

[RAvirani]

16 minutes ago, xmx1024 said:

Fair, and that can be tough in a more urban environment. All the conversion sites in my area in southern AZ were online within a week, and it seems all (if not most) in WA have not been turned on, even after multiple months.

The team down there might have done more planning before site builds or they may take a more ANR-focused approach when it comes to neighbor relations.  You'd be surprised how differently teams in different regions operate.  

[PedroDaGr8]

On 12/4/2021 at 8:36 PM, RAvirani said:

The team down there might have done more planning before site builds or they may take a more ANR-focused approach when it comes to neighbor relations.  You'd be surprised how differently teams in different regions operate.  

You would think they would have done extensive planning in advance when selecting to keep a site. Maybe that's being presumptuous.

[dkyeager]

18 minutes ago, PedroDaGr8 said:

You would think they would have done extensive planning in advance when selecting to keep a site. Maybe that's being presumptuous.

I don't think they knew how Sprint customers would behave.  Nor Boost Mobile customers.  Especially down to the cell site level.

[RAvirani]

On 12/6/2021 at 12:49 PM, PedroDaGr8 said:

You would think they would have done extensive planning in advance when selecting to keep a site. Maybe that's being presumptuous.

On 12/6/2021 at 1:10 PM, dkyeager said:

I don't think they knew how Sprint customers would behave.  Nor Boost Mobile customers.  Especially down to the cell site level.

When planning to close a coverage hole, network teams use a “search ring” methodology. Upon selecting a site that falls inside the ring, they will choose azimuths and mechanical downtilts that satisfy the coverage objective.

While softwares like Atoll/Planet/Asset (these are the three big ones) can provide very accurate propagation models, the models are only as good as the clutter data and clutter loss parameters (the DEM/DTM data is usually good enough to not worry about these days). For simulations (e.g. Monte-Carlo load simulations), you also need accurate traffic maps. As a result, some level of real-world testing is usually necessary to close out the electrical downtilts, exact RS ERPE per port, connection release/handoff parameters, etc.

After that, there’s a good bit of testing (call/integration/etc) that takes time too. On occasion, sites may also be delayed because they don’t have back haul or permanent power. This is more often the case in rural areas than urban/suburban areas. 

[PedroDaGr8]

Whelp, turns out the Woodinville National Glass site must have had a defective Nokia AEHC. When I drove by today, they were clearly replacing a panel. If you look closely you can see the worker on the TMobile rack. 

[danlodish345]

7 hours ago, RAvirani said:

When planning to close a coverage hole, network teams use a “search ring” methodology. Upon selecting a site that falls inside the ring, they will choose azimuths and mechanical downtilts that satisfy the coverage objective.

While softwares like Atoll and Planet (these are the two big ones) can provide very accurate propagation models, the models are only as good as the clutter data and clutter loss parameters (the DEM/DTM data is usually good enough to not worry about these days). For simulations (e.g. Monte-Carlo load simulations), you also need accurate traffic maps. As a result, some level of real-world testing is usually necessary to close out the electrical downtilts, exact RS ERPE per port, connection release/handoff parameters, etc.

After that, there’s a good bit of testing (call/integration/etc) that takes time too. On occasion, sites may also be delayed because they don’t have back haul or permanent power. This is more often the case in rural areas than urban/suburban areas. 

Very good description. And hi guys it’s been quite a long time.Very good description. And hi guys it’s been quite a long time.

[PedroDaGr8]

14 hours ago, danlodish345 said:

Very good description. And hi guys it’s been quite a long time.Very good description. And hi guys it’s been quite a long time.

Agreed, he did a great job and welcome back.

[danlodish345]

8 minutes ago, PedroDaGr8 said:

Agreed, he did a great job and welcome back.

Yes it’s good to be back. I’ve been on this website for nearly 7 years. And Sprint will live on through their spectrum.

[PedroDaGr8]

It appears T-Mobile is pushing forward with upgrading the Totem Lake Motel 6 site SMDH. I really hoped they would change their mind and scrap that site.

Permit to replace the hardware:

https://permitsearch.mybuildingpermit.com/PermitDetails/BNR21-09062/Kirkland

Permit to upgrade the site:

https://permitsearch.mybuildingpermit.com/PermitDetails/WIR21-00584/Kirkland