PRL 60685/51085 analysis

[4ringsnbr]

So out of the recent phones which ones do not support it? Epic? Epic Touch? Photon? Curious on the higher end Android smart phones in the past 2 yrs.

 

I'd have to look up the teardown of each one and then check the RF gear in question. Everything is available out there if you google it. As far as the E4GT (that name is too long!), its Avago AFCM-7325 Quadplexer is designed for band classes 0,1,10, & 14. Again, I'm not sure what the baseband firmware (radio ROM) will accept.

[Duffman]

It's the ratio of the power received from the carrier channel you're presently synced to for EVDO data versus the overall power received (it gives you an idea of the signal-to-noise ratio, but includes carrier pollution from other carriers with different PN offsets).

 

So it has nothing to do with the G channels? How would I tell? Channel Number in Debug?

 

 

FYI, with both 60683X and 60684X on my EVO, I am not seeing any PCS G (1225, 1250, 1275) search activity in Field Trial. Something seems amiss.

 

I am using CDMA Field Test. Is there a better app?

 

Sure wish someone would set up a primer on this stuff. I would like to be able to tell when they update towers in DFW.

[WiWavelength]

Yes, a "blank" PCS G block PRL would be ideal. When I do my drive testing in Kansas City, I am more concerned about actively searching channels 1225, 1250, and 1275 than about having phone functionality. Furthermore, I have all sorts of other Sprint, VZW, and Alltel PRLs stored on my SD card, so I can load another PRL that will restore operation at any time.

 

Thanks...

 

AJ

[4ringsnbr]

So it has nothing to do with the G channels? How would I tell? Channel Number in Debug?

 

 

 

 

I am using CDMA Field Test. Is there a better app?

 

Sure wish someone would set up a primer on this stuff. I would like to be able to tell when they update towers in DFW.

 

No-- the Ec/Io ratio is just for the channel you're on whatever channel that is. The only way I know of to find out which channel you're on is the EPST (built-in) field test (##DEBUG#) screen. You should see the channel scanning on the 1x engineering screen when your phone is in idle slotted mode.

[Duffman]

Ah. Channel 450.

[WiWavelength]

Ah. Channel 450.

 

Yes, in the Dallas-Fort Worth MTA, Sprint holds the PCS B block 30 MHz license. PCS B block CDMA1X/EV-DO standard channel assignments are 0425, 0450, 0475, 0500, 0525, 0550, 0575, 0600, 0625, 0650, 0675. Absent PCS G block, everyone of your Sprint channels in DFW will be one of those 11.

 

AJ

[WiWavelength]

Unfortunately, still no luck with 60000 nor 60001. My EVO never scans 1225, 1250, and 1275; it immediately goes off PRL and scans channel assignments (e.g. PCS A block 0050, 0075, 0200; Cellular A-side 0283, etc.) stored in memory, apparently, and on which it has previously located service.

 

Though the EVO should be band class 14 capable, all recent experience seems to indicate that firmware locks out that capability.

 

AJ

[4ringsnbr]

Unfortunately, still no luck with 60000 nor 60001. My EVO never scans 1225, 1250, and 1275; it immediately goes off PRL and scans channel assignments (e.g. PCS A block 0050, 0075, 0200; Cellular A-side 0283, etc.) stored in memory, apparently, and on which it has previously located service.

 

Though the EVO should be band class 14 capable, all recent experience seems to indicate that firmware locks out that capability.

 

AJ

 

Yeah-- the EVO has the hardware to do it, but it's likely the Radio ROM (baseband firmware) doesn't allow it. It's a software not a hardware problem. The phone was probably only tested and FCC approved for band class 0 & 1, so all other bands are probably blocked out via firmware. Obviously the extra 5 MHz in BC 14 shouldn't be an interference issue or anything, but if FCC doesn't approve it, the phone won't be allowed to do it. It's likely the testers' phones are using a custom firmware for the testing and likely operate under an FCC temporary facilities / testing waiver. It was worth a shot-- and there may be other phones in service whose firmware may not have been so restricted.

[digiblur]

 

I'd have to look up the teardown of each one and then check the RF gear in question. Everything is available out there if you google it. As far as the E4GT (that name is too long!), its Avago AFCM-7325 Quadplexer is designed for band classes 0,1,10, & 14. Again, I'm not sure what the baseband firmware (radio ROM) will accept.

 

Yeah, I don't think it would matter for the Epic anyways. It won't even roam over to use PCS band. It only roams on the cellular band. If I am in a vzw pcs only area I don't get no service when I am not within sprints area. In the rare occasion I am in an area with vzw pcs only I had to load a straight vzw prl to get signal.

 

Kinda sucks that Sprint neutered the Epic in roaming.

[MacinJosh]

My phone is showing Channel 25 and BC 1. Is that all PCS A block?

[4ringsnbr]

My phone is showing Channel 25 and BC 1. Is that all PCS A block?

Yes-- PCS A block is 25, 50, 75, 100, 125, 150, 175, 200, 225, 250, & 275. It is always one of these 11 channels. That's what Sprint has here in Baton Rouge too.

[4ringsnbr]

Yeah, I don't think it would matter for the Epic anyways. It won't even roam over to use PCS band. It only roams on the cellular band. If I am in a vzw pcs only area I don't get no service when I am not within sprints area. In the rare occasion I am in an area with vzw pcs only I had to load a straight vzw prl to get signal.

 

Kinda sucks that Sprint neutered the Epic in roaming.

I can make the G block scan native-- I just thought the flashing roam would be a nice "feature" for people to see. All I have to do is change the Roam Indicator field from 228 to 1 for all my "new" records (ACQ indices 32 & 34). But if the firmware doesn't support BC 14, it won't matter either way.

[MacinJosh]

Yes-- PCS A block is 25, 50, 75, 100, 125, 150, 175, 200, 225, 250, & 275. It is always one of these 11 channels. That's what Sprint has here in Baton Rouge too.

 

Thanks.

 

What other blocks of the PCS Spectrum does Sprint have? I now know the channel numbers for A,B, & G.

[4ringsnbr]

Thanks.

 

What other blocks of the PCS Spectrum does Sprint have? I now know the channel numbers for A,B, & G.

 

In bad, bad markets (Memphis, Atlanta, Houston), they have the "D" block I think (channels 325, 350, & 375 only). You can imagine how bad their service would be; however, in most of these markets (that Sprint cares about), they've added a few neighboring channel blocks like A5 (so they can use channels 275 and 300) or B1 (so they can use channels 400 and 425). Some markets, however, only have 3 available channels. E block is 725, 750, & 775. F block is 825, 850, & 875. C block is 925, 950, 975, 1000, 1025, 1050, 1075, 1100, 1125, 1150, & 1175. The inbetween channels are only valid if the licensee holds the channels on the other side (300, 400, 700, 800, 900, & 1200) require you to have the channels in the next block (or at least the first (or last) channel in that block.

[MacinJosh]

Thanks for the info 4rings.

[WiWavelength]

My phone is showing Channel 25 and BC 1. Is that all PCS A block?

 

Yes. Sprint holds the PCS A block 30 MHz license in both the Los Angeles-San Diego MTA (which extends beyond Las Vegas) and the San Francisco-Oakland-San Jose MTA (which extends beyond Visalia). So, some/all of those 11 standard PCS A block channel assignments that 4ringsnbr detailed for you are the only native Sprint channels that you will encounter in California.

 

AJ

[MacinJosh]

Wow. Talk about a large stretch. Is A block the better part of the PCS Spectrum?

[MacinJosh]

Does anyone have the time to make a map that details what blocks of the PCS Spectrum and where they are located that Sprint holds? I would love to see one and have for reference. Or maybe I could build it if I can find some free time.

[WiWavelength]

What other blocks of the PCS Spectrum does Sprint have? I now know the channel numbers for A,B, & G.

 

Josh, Sprint holds mostly PCS A/B block 30 MHz licenses (or disaggregated portions thereof) and PCS D/E block 10 MHz licenses. Conversely, Sprint holds very few PCS C block 30 MHz licenses (or disaggregated portions thereof) and PCS F block 10 MHz licenses. PCS C/F block licenses were originally intended for designated entities (new entrants, small businesses, minority groups, etc.), not major wireless carriers.

 

My Sprint spectrum catalog and map are out of date yet still about 90 percent accurate. See here:

 

http://people.ku.edu/~cinema/wireless/spcs.html

http://people.ku.edu/~cinema/wireless/spcs_map.html

 

AJ

[MacinJosh]

I guess that answers my question about the map part of it. Thanks AJ.

[digiblur]

Do you have the data for the licenses that Sprint currently has? It would take a while to pick it out piece my piece out of the fcc spectrum dashboard.

[MacinJosh]

Holy cow! I'm on the Ubiquitel SID here in Visalia.

[WiWavelength]

Wow. Talk about a large stretch. Is A block the better part of the PCS Spectrum?

 

The PCS A/B block 30 MHz licenses are equivalent. They were the first PCS 1900 MHz licenses in the world and were auctioned in 1994-1995.

 

Sprint won the greatest number of PCS A/B block licenses nationally, followed by AT&TWS (the original AT&T, not the SBC based AT&T that we know today), then PrimeCo (which was part of the original VZW merger), then the carriers that eventually merged to become T-Mobile (Aerial, Omnipoint, Powertel, VoiceStream).

 

AJ

[WiWavelength]

Do you have the data for the licenses that Sprint currently has? It would take a while to pick it out piece my piece out of the fcc spectrum dashboard.

 

I have culled current data from the FCC ULS and have updated most of the top markets. For example, I have this XLSX file in progress:

 

http://people.ku.edu/~cinema/sprint150.jpg

 

The markets below the top 100, however, are going to be a real task to bring up to date, as PCS licenses have oft been partitioned & disaggregated down to the county level (or even lower).

 

AJ

[MacinJosh]

I have culled current data from the FCC ULS and have updated most of the top markets. For example, I have this XLSX file in progress:

 

http://people.ku.edu...a/sprint150.jpg

 

AJ

 

Awesome. It will be nice to see the completed file. And where do I find the ownership info for the SMR licenses? I have never been able to locate them on the FCC website.