Network Vision/LTE - Upper Central Valley Market (Sacramento, Stockton, Redding, Eureka & Reno/Lake Tahoe)

[kytopgun]

Nexus 5! Alright! So now you can tell us where your getting TD-LTE all over Sacramento and test the speeds!......but probably not right away until they push an update for Sprint Spark correct?

Edited November 9, 2013 by lilotimz

[Juned]

Were you able to get a SIM? Mine arrives today and have not been able to SIM. It's on back order with sprint online

 

Sent from my SPH-L900 using Tapatalk 2

 

[da_kiem]

awesome.  I have to wait for a bit for mine :/ 

[LuisBOSS302]

And Modesto, according to a Sprint rep on their facebook page, won't go live for another 3 months!

 

I'm expecting this area to be on of the last to get LTE...

 

Never trust what sprint reps say.

[GiantJay]

Everyone in mobile has a mandatory in store training next Saturday for Sprint. Could be a good sign.

Sent from my SPH-L720 using Tapatalk
 

[da_kiem]

Everyone in mobile has a mandatory in store training next Saturday for Sprint. Could be a good sign.

 

Sent from my SPH-L720 using Tapatalk

 

Hey GiantJay what came out of the training?

 

Does anyone know what the sprint spark update will be?  Software update for phones, new PRL, something else?

 

I just got my Nexus 5 

[lilotimz]

Hey GiantJay what came out of the training?

 

Does anyone know what the sprint spark update will be?  Software update for phones, new PRL, something else?

 

I just got my Nexus 5 

 

Software update to enable Band 41 + Band 26 connectivity. 

[lilotimz]

Alright so here's what's been discovered in the past day. New triband phones such as the LG G2 and Nexus 5 (and presumably all Spark - triband devices) have been having trouble connecting to LTE in certain places while working fine in others. Some folks found some documents sent out to Sprint reps and have posted it and I've quoted it. 

 

 

As I mentioned earlier, I'm cross-posting this here as well since it is directly related to the G2 currently...

 

Sprint eCSFB Gap Issue Legal Approved Talking Points:

 

eCSFB Gap Talking Points

 

Sprint’s Network Vision Plan (Spectrum)

• Sprint’s Network Vision plan includes access to three spectrum bands, (1.9, 800 and 2.5), and LTE handsets with a single radio.
• Access to diverse spectrum assets allows Sprint to maximize capacity and coverage.

Current Sprint LTE Devices (2 Radios)

• Current Sprint LTE devices are Simultaneous Voice and LTE (SVLTE)—using two radios, one for voice and one for LTE data. This allows CDMA calls and LTE to operate at the same time.
• Dual Radio SVLTE devices can degrade the user’s quality of experience – two antennas may slow throughput at the cell edge and reduce battery life.

Future Sprint LTE Devices (1 Radio)

• CSFB and eCSFB (Circuit Switch Fall Back and enhanced Circuit Switch Fall Back) are features that enable single radio functionality in the handset.
  • eCSFB Benefits:
    • With eCSFB implementation, Sprint will be able to offer fast LTE data speeds and 3G voice supported on single radio devices. This provides a more cost effective option for Sprint’s long-term business plans to support additional spectrum bands.
    • eCSFB is expected to improve handset battery life compared to SVLTE.

eCSFB Gap Issue – What you Need to know:

• Smart devices require eCSFB to “fall back” to 3G to accept a voice call if the user is connected to the LTE network.
• All markets need to be upgraded with eCSFB capability.
• eCSFB Gaps are only in non-incumbent markets where a site has 4G LTE and no 3G upgrade.

4G LTE integration with 3G is different by OEM type:

• Incumbent markets – LTE 4G only sites can communicate with either legacy 3G or NV 3G sites.
• Non-Incumbent – LTE 4G can only communicate with NV 3G sites; so individual sites need both NV upgrades.

LTE devices – Customer Experience

• When 4G LTE is deployed in a non-incumbent market on sites without upgrade to 3G service, there is a gap.
  • Existing Devices – No Impact
  • eCSFB Devices – Phone becomes 3G only device

Non-Launched Markets

• No coverage visible on Sprint.com maps but different experience for users with existing devices versus new eCSFB devices.

Launched Markets

• Sprint coverage tools will display LTE coverage. For new LTE smart device users this could be confusing since they would expect LTE and 3G coverage with the device they purchased, but would not experience LTE until the 3G network is upgraded.

Mitigation plan:

 

New LTE Markets

• When locking new LTE markets for announcement/ launch, eCSFB deployment status will be a factor in the analysis. New LTE markets will not be announced unless the eCSFB gap risk is low.
• Complete the build quickly in eCSFB gap impacted markets.

Acronyms

• CSFB – Circuit Switch Fall Back. It allows for single radio devices. (ERC)
• eCSFB – Enhanced Circuit Switch Fall Back Next generation CSFB. (ALU, STA)
• SVLTE – Simultaneous Voice & LTE. Allows CDMA calls and LTE to operate simultaneously
• Incumbent – An incumbent market is one in which the OEM stays the same as before Network Vision
• Non-incumbent – A market in which the OEM changes as well as all of the equipment.
• ERC - Ericsson
• ALU – Alcatel Lucent
• STA - Samsung
• NV – Network Vision
• OEM – Original Equipment Manufacturer (ERC, ALU, STA)
• Gap – 4G LTE on sites without appropriate upgrades to 3G service
• 1.9 GHz Spectrum - Provides initial capacity and coverage for voice and data services.
• 800 MHz Spectrum - Improves coverage and in-building penetration for all services.
• 2.5 GHz Spectrum - Increases data capacity to support higher data demands and more users.

.

Our market is a Samsung vendor region and our legacy network is Lucent. This means that our market and the rest of all the Samsung markets are non-incumbent regions where Spark - Triband devices will not work on LTE unless the site you're connected to both Network Vision 3G and 4G. If a tower is only upgraded on 4G then your device will not work due to the requirement of having enhanced Circuit Fall Back Switch which are only available on Network Vision equipment. 

 

As such, the document clearly states that the only recourse to fix this issue is to upgrade the non-incumbent markets eCSFB Gaps as quickly as possible. This explains why every Samsung market (including ours) have so many sites that have been physically converted but not fired up or accepted and when they do it's done via a large cluster like Reno - Sparks (34 sites). 

 

So basically yeah.. they're doing large cluster launches now instead of bringing up sites one by one. 

[GiantJay]

Hey GiantJay what came out of the training?

 

Does anyone know what the sprint spark update will be? Software update for phones, new PRL, something else?

 

I just got my Nexus 5

Next Saturday is the training. Nobody even knows what it's about yet.

 

Sent from my SPH-L720 using Tapatalk

 

 

[da_kiem]

Next Saturday is the training. Nobody even knows what it's about yet.

 

Sent from my SPH-L720 using Tapatalk

Oh ok.  I got a statement from a guy on reddit that starting on the 22nd his non-corporate store will be offering One Up, so maybe that's it?

[da_kiem]

Alright so here's what's been discovered in the past day. New triband phones such as the LG G2 and Nexus 5 (and presumably all Spark - triband devices) have been having trouble connecting to LTE in certain places while working fine in others. Some folks found some documents sent out to Sprint reps and have posted it and I've quoted it. 

 

.

Our market is a Samsung vendor region and our legacy network is Nortel. This means that our market and the rest of all the Samsung markets are non-incumbent regions where Spark - Triband devices will not work on LTE unless the site you're connected to both Network Vision 3G and 4G. If a tower is only upgraded on 4G then your device will not work due to the requirement of having enhanced Circuit Fall Back Switch which are only available on Network Vision equipment. 

 

As such, the document clearly states that the only recourse to fix this issue is to upgrade the non-incumbent markets eCSFB Gaps as quickly as possible. This explains why every Samsung market (including ours) have so many sites that have been physically converted but not fired up or accepted and when they do it's done via a large cluster like Reno - Sparks (34 sites). 

 

So basically yeah.. they're doing large cluster launches now instead of bringing up sites one by one. 

So they need to update the 3G to NV before it will work.  Why do they have to cluster launch the sites for this to work though?  Why can't they just launch NV 3G sites like they were with the 4G sites?

[lilotimz]

So they need to update the 3G to NV before it will work.  Why do they have to cluster launch the sites for this to work though?  Why can't they just launch NV 3G sites like they were with the 4G sites?

Hard handoffs (dropped calls) when going from legacy to network vision or NV to legacy. 

[GiantJay]

So they need to update the 3G to NV before it will work. Why do they have to cluster launch the sites for this to work though? Why can't they just launch NV 3G sites like they were with the 4G sites?

It's how they do the back haul and software updates.

 

Sent from my SPH-L720 using Tapatalk

 

 

[kytopgun]

Alright so here's what's been discovered in the past day. New triband phones such as the LG G2 and Nexus 5 (and presumably all Spark - triband devices) have been having trouble connecting to LTE in certain places while working fine in others. Some folks found some documents sent out to Sprint reps and have posted it and I've quoted it. 

 

.

Our market is a Samsung vendor region and our legacy network is Nortel. This means that our market and the rest of all the Samsung markets are non-incumbent regions where Spark - Triband devices will not work on LTE unless the site you're connected to both Network Vision 3G and 4G. If a tower is only upgraded on 4G then your device will not work due to the requirement of having enhanced Circuit Fall Back Switch which are only available on Network Vision equipment. 

 

As such, the document clearly states that the only recourse to fix this issue is to upgrade the non-incumbent markets eCSFB Gaps as quickly as possible. This explains why every Samsung market (including ours) have so many sites that have been physically converted but not fired up or accepted and when they do it's done via a large cluster like Reno - Sparks (34 sites). 

 

So basically yeah.. they're doing large cluster launches now instead of bringing up sites one by one. 

 

This makes complete sense why our market has not seen more activations lately. More or less it is involved with the new (Samsung) OEM's equipment not being able to talk to another old (Nortel) OEM's equipment, but also more strictly to a newer device using eCSFB. We would have huge Gaps everywhere for normal voice coverage if they brought sites online slowly. Reno was a non-incumbent market....so are we in Sacramento. My guess is they are going to light up all of Sacramento with NV 3G first or maybe NV 3G and 4G at the same time, but not just sites with NV 4G. Then turn on NV 4G on sites that have at a minimum been NV 3G accepted. Roseville for example is one area where they have NV 4G, but are running Legacy 3G. The tri-band phones will have problems out there until they cluster launch NV 3G. I think were just going to wake up one morning and Sprint will have flipped 100+ sites in Sacramento to NV 3G or NV 3G+4G. Something big here is imminent..

[da_kiem]

How does this effect the WiMAX towers? Same issue, or could they flip those and get LTE on Spark Phones without issues?

[mrguzman83]

Any word on whats going with Stockton? I know Sacramento is being worked on, but man the past week or so has been terrible service for Stockton (more than usual).

 

Dropped calls, 0.1 - 0.2mpbs data speeds. Often time no data at all. Makes me wonder if they are working on something this week.

[GiantJay]

My Nexus 5 will be here tomorrow.

 

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[lilotimz]

My Nexus 5 will be here tomorrow.

 

Sent from my SPH-L720 using Tapatalk

 

Hope you enjoy T-mobile ;-)

[LuisBOSS302]

Any word on whats going with Stockton? I know Sacramento is being worked on, but man the past week or so has been terrible service for Stockton (more than usual).

 

Dropped calls, 0.1 - 0.2mpbs data speeds. Often time no data at all. Makes me wonder if they are working on something this week.

Really? Which area in Stockton ? I seen speed updates by the movie theaters and on march lane by in n out. I've been getting constant 3G speeds of 1mbps and higher in those areas.

 

Who knows when we'll get lte. I was told my march, then beginning of summer, and ending of summer. It's anyone guess but I'll be surprised to the extreme if I see any lte in Stockton by March when my contract is up.

[GiantJay]

Hope you enjoy T-mobile ;-)

Not quite sure what I'm doing but highly likely I'm going to go there. I'm going to activate it on Sprint and see what my meeting with Sprint is about on Saturday at least. Test out my work area with the new phone. It will put my mind at ease just knowing I can take my phone anywhere but Verizon when I want. I would never go to Verizon anyway. But Ya, I have a pretty much new Single-Band LTE Galaxy S4 for sale now. Lol.

 

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[lilotimz]

Not quite sure what I'm doing but highly likely I'm going to go there. I'm going to activate it on Sprint and see what my meeting with Sprint is about on Saturday at least. Test out my work area with the new phone. It will put my mind at ease just knowing I can take my phone anywhere but Verizon when I want. I would never go to Verizon anyway. But Ya, I have a pretty much new Single-Band LTE Galaxy S4 for sale now. Lol.

 

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You won't get LTE with a N5 (or a G2... S4 mini.. mega 6.3.. tribands) on Sprint unless you force the phone into LTE only mode (no voice 1x). Explained it on my above post. Pretty disappointing but sheds some light on the "lack of progress" in the area. 

[GiantJay]

You won't get LTE with a N5 (or a G2... S4 mini.. mega 6.3.. tribands) on Sprint unless you force the phone into LTE only mode (no voice 1x). Explained it on my above post. Pretty disappointing but sheds some light on the "lack of progress" in the area.

I don't get lte with my S4 anywhere I go anyway. It switches back and forth from 3g to lte when I'm at work but it's a bad thing. I wish it would just stay on 3g or LTE. Come to think of it I might turn lte off when I'm at work. We shall see on the N5.

 

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[WeRtechSupport]

Any word on whats going with Stockton? I know Sacramento is being worked on, but man the past week or so has been terrible service for Stockton (more than usual).

 

Dropped calls, 0.1 - 0.2mpbs data speeds. Often time no data at all. Makes me wonder if they are working on something this week.

 

I'm seeing this around downtown and all across the crosstown and 99. In lodi as well. The area by Raley's is pretty speedy(for sprint, that is) 

 

 

Really? Which area in Stockton ? I seen speed updates by the movie theaters and on march lane by in n out. I've been getting constant 3G speeds of 1mbps and higher in those areas.

 

Who knows when we'll get lte. I was told my march, then beginning of summer, and ending of summer. It's anyone guess but I'll be surprised to the extreme if I see any lte in Stockton by March when my contract is up.

 

+1 on this, march and i5 has been decent the past months. 

[mrguzman83]

I'm seeing this around downtown and all across the crosstown and 99. In lodi as well. The area by Raley's is pretty speedy(for sprint, that is) 

 

 

 

 

+1 on this, march and i5 has been decent the past months.

 

I have not tried it downtown. I work in north Stockton at the Kaiser facility and the service in that area and all through west Hammer lane has been barely usable at all. On some days for a few moments the 3G service will work and even jump to about 1mbps. But it doesn't last. I've been testing the speeds inside as well as outside the area. But the results are very weak, more so in the past two weaks or so.

[LuisBOSS302]

I have not tried it downtown. I work in north Stockton at the Kaiser facility and the service in that area and all through west Hammer lane has been barely usable at all. On some days for a few moments the 3G service will work and even jump to about 1mbps. But it doesn't last. I've been testing the speeds inside as well as outside the area. But the results are very weak, more so in the past two weaks or so.

 

Very true in North Stockton the speeds are very poor. Hopefully we get some good news soon.

 

Keep an eye out for your closest towers. You can donate $5 to this site to become a sponsor and you'll see where are your closest towers to spot any new Sprint equipment.

 

I was suppose to go tower hunting the past month but have been so caught up in school, work, and soccer.