Trip

Considering adding this phone to my collection:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01F9N5QXI

Particularly for catching AT&T HSPA (unactivated SIM) and possibly T-Mobile AWS/PCS LTE since my LG Leon tends to camp on 700.  What does SCP do on a device with dual SIM support?  Can it see both at once or is it just one at a time?

- Trip

Saw B41 (and second carrier) in Harrisonburg on Monday. 

I have a question.  The Shentel region is the first Sprint region (as opposed to nTelos) where I've seen B25 second carrier.  For example, I saw second carrier in Luray, though the site west of town did not have it.  I was under the impression that the single NV panel could handle multiple B25 carriers, but when I looked at the tower, I saw two panels, the NV panel and something else.  There was no B41 present, so I assume it wasn't an 8T8R (unless it just hadn't been activated yet?).  Below are pictures.  Any ideas what they could be?

http://imgur.com/uGSKPTt

http://imgur.com/AUVLyJA

The other rack is Verizon.

- Trip

Interesting; I do hope sequential PCIs are coming to all markets.  All other carriers have them except Sprint, in my experience.  Whether the PCIs for different bands line up seems to vary:

Verizon:  Consistent across bands everywhere I've been.

AT&T:  Consistent across bands in DC market, not in other markets I've been to.

T-Mobile:  PCIs, like GCIs, vary wildly, including some sequential and some not, but seems sequential more often than not.  Not consistent across bands in the DC market.

Shentel:  169 offset, but consistent across all three bands.

nTelos:  Consistent across bands.

US Cellular:  No idea, phone doesn't record PCI.  Have yet to LTE roam in a place with both B5 and B12 to get the PCI with my Sprint phone which does record PCI.

- Trip

Can anyone identify this tower and let me know if it is a Sprint tower? This is beside my work here in Charlottesville and I'm assuming the address would be Avon Street Extended. I have always had weak LTE signal here but full EVDO and two weeks ago they placed the big white panel on top and now I have full Band 26.

 

 

I know it's not the best picture but the best I can get at the moment

 

Thanks! 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

http://www.albemarle.org/weblink/3/doc/317036/Page1.aspx?searchid=d64b72a3-c907-4625-b34f-e4a47e816b03

- Trip

Isn't it just that whenever it is connected to Sprint, it will not roam at all? Since you're on the Sprint network? I would be surprised if you could roam on USCC LTE while connected to Sprint 1x.

 

Back when I monitored CDMA networks extensively, it used to be that when you were roaming on 1x, you could connect to Sprint EVDO too, if it came in range. But you could not be connected to Sprint 1x and roam on EVDO. The rule basically is, if you can get a Sprint native 1x signal, then no roaming. The network considers you home.

 

I would guess it's not so much the device knows no SRLTE is available and thus stops roaming, but rather the CDMA stays in scan while LTE roaming (SRLTE mode), and if it finds and connects to Sprint network (even if just 1x), the LTE roaming session ends because the device is now native. That could appear as if SRLTE was shut down at that time.

 

Just a hypothesis on my part. But I have no way to check myself.

 

 

Using Tapatalk on Note 8.0

You're missing my point.  Normally, my phone shows me LTE only--no 1X.  However, while I was roaming, I was continually seeing both 1X and LTE.  So I believe this is the way the phone determines whether or not it should be LTE roaming.

- Trip

So, first off, I upgraded to the LG G5 in May which supported LTE roaming.  Finally got a chance to sit in US Cellular territory recently and here's what was seen at my in-laws' house:

I had been wondering how the phone would know when to LTE roam and when not to, given the presence of 3G-only areas of the Sprint network.  It appears that whenever I am LTE roaming, SRLTE is enabled, which thus shows 1X and LTE at the same time.  However, the moment the 1X side of things jumps to Sprint, I immediately lose LTE roaming.  My guess is that this is the deciding factor on whether or not a device is allowed to LTE roam--the availability of SRLTE.

Of course, this behavior made my in-laws' house very tricky, because every so often the phone would jump to a very, very weak (-105 dBm) 1X 800 from 10-15 miles away.  Every time it did, I would lose LTE roaming, and all other service, until it gave up and went back to US Cellular.  My parents' house, when I visit, should not have this problem, since there is no Sprint service for miles and miles.

That being said, it worked very well when connected to US Cellular.  Of course, EV-DO roaming STILL doesn't work, despite the fact that LTE roaming works on this device.  It's very strange.

- Trip.

NPRM = Notice of Proposed Rule-Making

NOI = Notice of Inquiry

FCC/government agency terms.

- Trip

Why won't Sprint just come in with a 15x15 immediately where they can instead of 10x10 and a separate 5x5? Continuous blocks will always be a better solution than split. You think they would know this by now.

Unfortunately, you can't run a contiguous LTE carrier across PCS and 800, as that's impossible to do.  So 10x10 PCS C+G and 5x5 800 is likely to be the solution in the short- to mid-term.

- Trip

^ This; it's all GCI-based. AT&T is very clean with its GCI patterns. I have a very reliable source who provides me with nearly all of my AT&T info. If anyone on AT&T sees a GCI but doesn't see a band indicator, grab a screenshot and let me know; I believe the app has that network 100% covered at the moment.

 

-Mike

You've got mail.

- Trip

^ This; it's all GCI-based. AT&T is very clean with its GCI patterns. I have a very reliable source who provides me with nearly all of my AT&T info. If anyone on AT&T sees a GCI but doesn't see a band indicator, grab a screenshot and let me know; I believe the app has that network 100% covered at the moment.

 

-Mike

What ironic timing!  Yesterday, while I was out and about, I think I spotted the first four-sector AT&T site I've ever seen.  It fit the pattern except the fourth sector was a logical continuation of the existing pattern--and was not identified accordingly.  So LTE 1900 was 08/09/0A/0B, LTE 700 was 0F/10/11/12, and LTE AWS was 16/17/18/19, but the 0B, 12, and 19 sectors were not IDed.  I have screenshots on my AT&T phone and will send them later.

- Trip

One day, every populated neighborhood will have small cells.  And then property values everywhere will be zero!

- Trip

Mike...

 

In displaying "W-DAS," what/how is SignalCheck Pro detecting DAS?  I see this occasionally, often just fleetingly on AT&T band 17 and band 4.  I do not think that I have caught it on AT&T band 2.

 

 

AJ

I'm pretty sure Mike is detecting based on the last two digits of the GCI.  AT&T is very consistent in that way.

I've seen B2 DAS before, but mostly B17.

- Trip

Every time I go by there, I always hope for LTE.  So far, disappointment every time.  (Sad, since the Troy ShenTelos tower down 15 has LTE now.)  But it really is unusable; the signal does almost nothing there, too.  I'm guessing that's what the pre-NV gear was like nation wide.

- Trip

Not sure if this is new, but I just noticed that Sprint's towers in Rappahannock County, Virginia are not included on the map, even though, to my knowledge, Sprint is the only carrier with coverage in large parts of that county. 

On top of that, no B41 is shown in the Shentel region even though we know it exists.

I'm also puzzled to see that US Cellular is unavailable for LTE roaming in Halifax County, VA, even though the surrounding US Cellular counties do have it.

- Trip

It's not the device. I had this issue with a Galaxy S5 and two other Nexus 5x (M8994F is the current one). I also see it with the iPhones in the other lines I have under contract (though iPhone engineering screen can't be trusted). I've always had access to good RSRP and SNR on B25 (surprisingly, SNR is way better for me on B25 than it is on B26). Unfortunately the network just isn't working as it should. It's gotten better...that I will admit, but not good enough. In 2014, all Tri-band devices would be exclusively parked on B26. Today, I see B25 more now, but not enough to make the network consistent.

 

One thing I do admire about T-Mobile in this part of the state is that their network is extremely aggressive at getting you to switch to B4 LTE if you happen to fall to B12. Which is good for their network because parts of midtown have brought T-Mobile's network to its knees. A Sprint 5x5 B25 carrier outperforms T-Mobile's 20x20 B4 in that area.

I'm not going to outright disagree, but this does not match my experience.  My S5 never saw B25, with my phone basically putting me directly on B26 if B41 was not available, but now that I've moved to an LG G5, I now see B25 much more regularly. 

On the contrary, my LG Leon LTE for T-Mobile, if it happens to drop to B12, even an Airplane Mode toggle won't get it back onto B4.  Sometimes a full device reboot won't get it back onto B4.  The only real guaranteed way to get it back on B4 is to go to an area without B12.

- Trip

That I don't know, but even if they did, it would have been 1X roaming, presumably.

- Trip

Don't you still have access to USCC (3G/LTE) via Sprint? Or is it just 1x only for talk/text?

 

Fi is expensive though.  It is only good if you use less than 1GB of data.  If you use ~1GB or a little more and want coverage, might as well jump on Cricket or something.

Supposedly EV-DO roaming was available, but it never worked on my S5 or my wife's Moto X.  I only ever got 1X; executive support was never able to track down why.  My G5 supposedly supports LTE roaming; we'll find out next time I'm home.  But, as noted, 100MB cap.

Fi would represent a huge savings for me.  I've got a 4GB plan split 3 ways right now, and have never gone over.  $111 for that, not counting phone costs.  Jumping to Fi would drop it to $90, and I would have no roaming cap on US Cellular.

And I'm a Sprint customer because of US Cellular roaming.  AT&T/Cricket has no service where I need it.

- Trip

Sigh.  I reupped with Sprint less than a month ago.  With US Cellular included, Fi is now perfect for me.

- Trip

They should really start building the 1000 permits they have now instead of waiting for more before getting started.

- Trip

Is there?  I thought either Sprint had it all, or it was licensed in such a way that nobody could use it.

- Trip

I think what would have been cooler is fixed wireless services in certain areas.  Carriers have all this spectrum, and in rural areas it doesn't get used.  These rural areas might have a poor dsl offering or no offering at all.  Where my dad lives, he only has fixed wireless as an option.  He pays $70/mo for 2Mbps. Yet I can pull in over 100Mbps on Sprint's B41 outside and 40Mbps inside.  My brother at his house only has a Windstream 1.5Mbps connection.  My uncle and brother in law have zero internet providers (outside satellite) yet live very close to a tower with three major carriers on it. 

 

 

That would be disruptive imo.

A variation on this, right here, is the way to handle rural deployment.  I wish someone would do it.

My thought would be to partner with small local ISPs to do a full build.  For example, where my parents live and using T-Mobile as the example, Kinex Telecom could deploy all three T-Mobile bands (700 5x5, AWS 20x20, and PCS 20x20), selling both fixed and mobile service on that spectrum.  In lieu of lease fees, Kinex would buy the equipment, pay the rent, pay the backhaul fees, etc. and T-Mobile customers who go through the area would get to use that rather than roaming (or no service). 

I imagine the Sprint/Shentel arrangement is similar, albeit on a much larger scale.

It's a real shame nobody is doing something like that, because it would win a lot of good will and a lot of rural customers, while gaining a lot of rural coverage at little or no cost.

- Trip

That's what I mean by co-located. So you have ALU NV sites with legacy Clearwire WiMAX still there?

Seems that way.  A bunch of them were dual mode, it seems, and quite a few (not all) are running second carrier. 

My home site is B25/B26 plus Clear B41 with second carrier.  The next site over has B25/B26 and Clear B41 without second carrier.  A site down the road toward Wegmans has Clear equipment on it without Sprint, presumably turned off now that WiMax is gone, but T-Mobile has AWS and 700 on that one.  And the site at Wegmans is B25/B26 with Clear not running B41.  No 8T8R either.

- Trip

Maybe they can't be upgraded at all and need to be moved. Maybe they can't get access to the building anymore.

There are actually a few that seem to be that way here.  There are two on power lines that don't seem to have been touched and are 3G only.  One would actually probably be my home site if it were running LTE--it seems to be for T-Mobile, at least.  But T-Mobile is running both AWS and 700 LTE from it--I actually drove by the day they were putting up the 700 panels--and all three of the other carriers have multiple LTE bands on their power line poles in the same area, but not Sprint. 

Another is on the roof of a hotel where AT&T and T-Mobile both have LTE service.  Sprint, apparently, plans to move to a hotel next door, but I've seen nothing to indicate it's happening any time soon.

- Trip

Are most of them co-located?

Most of what?  Many of the Clear sites here are co-located with Sprint, though certainly not all.  There are some WiMax-only Clear sites on the same structure as B25/B26 only Sprint and some that are not co-located at all.  And some Sprint-only sites without B41.

- Trip

I think Sprint's coverage is good, as long as you don't care what kind of coverage it is.  I still see 3G pretty often.

But there's no reason why there should be places on the Beltway where only B25/B26 are available.  Or I-66.  And there DEFINITELY should not be 3G-only non-NV installations still floating around.

- Trip