ericdabbs

They rarely get it wrong..

If that is the case then that is good news.  I might consider getting the Nexus 6P version now instead of the 5X.  The difference between a 32 GB Nexus 5X (probably $50 more) and a 32 GB Nexus 6P (rumored base model) will probably be about $50 - $70.

Dang... $379.99 starting point for the 5X with these specs?  Seems a bit steep to me.

I'm more interested in the 6P and can only imagine what they'll charge if the 5X is starting at almost 4 bills.

Already have the cash saved up but may just have to buy a 2014 Nexus 6.

 

Who am I kidding?

According to these 2 related articles the Nexus 5X will start at $380 and the Nexus 6P will start at $500.  We will have to see tomorrow if Android Police got this right.

Nexus 5X

http://www.androidpolice.com/2015/09/28/nexus-5x-will-start-at-379-99-available-for-pre-order-on-september-29th-in-the-u-s-uk-korea-japan-and-ireland/

Nexus 6P

http://www.androidpolice.com/2015/09/28/exclusive-nexus-6p-will-be-available-for-pre-order-on-september-29th-starting-499-99-in-the-u-s-uk-ireland-canada-and-japan/

I don't think it does. The billions sprint is spending on NGN is largely self financed. To the extent they are receiving any additional capital from SoftBank it comes in the form of the leasing facilities they are setting up, which in the in is nothing more than a low interest loan. If sprint had made the decision to participate in the 600 auction it would have been a clear and unambiguous sign that SoftBank believed in a sprint turn around with or with out T-Mobile as it would have required an additional capital investment in sprint by SoftBank (probably would have had to tap the Japanese bond market). So this is not a good sign and points to doubts on softbanks part. At the same time SoftBank increasing their position in sprint points the other way. I think the most likely play SoftBank is aiming for is trying to make sprint more attractive to a potential buyer by improving its competitiveness (this plays niecely with marcelo's recent comments about sprint and a cable company tie up) while waiting on events in the US regulatory environment to change in favor of the T-Mobile merger.

 

In the in I think SoftBank will either stay with sprint or not depending on weather or not they believe they can merge with T-Mobile, but that is just a guess.

I was thinking that this was the case as well.  I remember reading an aritcle on fiercewireless that the NGN  project that said that they have been getting network vendor financing to help fund the costs.

Robert you definitely have a good point there.  Perhaps this is a ploy by Sprint to join the big 2 in claiming they have enough spectrum for now in hopes of delaying the auction for another 2-3 years or so...so that it helps Sprint buy time to execute the NGN project.  I am actually starting to like this scenario more if it can pan out.

Certainly if the FCC does delay it for another 2-3 years then by the time 2018 comes around the big 2 and Sprint carriers can re-evaluate to see if 600 MHz can be auctioned off again.  I guess that would also give broadcasters more time to plan out what it would take for them to vacate the frequencies.

This market has reached saturation, with over 300 million cellphones already out there. So all these companies can hope for is to steal customers away from one another. 

 

What would make more economic sense to you? go on an all out war with the other to gain 3-4 million customers a year at best for the next few years, using that 15 billion dollars for the spectrum plus deployment, or gain over 50 million customers in one shot for roughly the same amount including that precious spectrum your clamoring for.

 

If Softband still in it to purchase Tmobile, it would totally make sense to sit out the auction.

 

I understand that buying out a competitor is the easier solution and it sounds like people are jumping on that bandwagon that a merger is going to happen again. The question is in what circumstances do you realistically think the US regulators would allow a Sprint and Tmobile merger?  If your premise of how the NGN plan is going to improve the Sprint network dramatically in the next several years and if Tmobile obtains 600 MHz and begins to provide more native coverage to improve their network, regulators are going to see it as both businesses are thriving so why need to merge?  To me it sounds like that would be the argument against the merger.  You really think Sprint sitting out of the 600 MHz auction will resolve all regulator concerns? Doubt it. 

The only way to show regulators that a merger is warranted is if both carriers are struggling tremendously and that a merger would improve both companies.  With the way that both carriers are shaping right now (Tmobile rising since Legere took over (doesn't matter what his antics are...its working) and Sprint stopping the bleeding in Q1), do you really think that its going to happen?  It doesn't matter what DT and Sprint/Softbank want because I am sure when Masa tried to talk to US regulators last year, DT was probably on board or else you wouldn't hear of any traction in the first place but there had to have been a reason for Masa to back out entirely.

Call me naive but Sprint and Tmobile going at it to compete has actually helped Sprint create new programs that were borrowed from Tmobile.  Who would have thought that Sprint would provide the Sprint Global 2G Roaming worldwide and Sprint Open World products if it weren't for Tmobile.  Those 2 programs have been nice perks for new and current Sprint customers...I know I certainly enjoy it. Not only that but Sprint introducing these new iPhone leasing programs are certainly welcomed for iPhone users.  So if you ask me if competition is good...I would say a HELL YEAH!!

Oh and then there is that old age question if Sprint/Tmobile merged which is how to integrate the two networks together?  Can't shut down the GSM/HSPA+ network right away and guess what huge increase OPEX and CAPEX  in incurred to maintain both networks.  How is that any cheaper?

If Sprint and Tmobile can pull off a merger...kudos to Sprint and Masa and I will be the first to eat my words and support it but I think the chances of that happen is about as big as the 600 MHz spectrum being deployed within the next 3 years.

You are seeing this short term. Remember, Sprint has enough spectrum and needs to use it first. Adding yet another radio, or switching current radios is additional capex. You need to have handsets that use the spectrum and there is currently no device able to handle the 600Mhz. Sprint has 800Mhz nationwide. Let other companies battle it out and just buy the other companies later. You need high capacity bands and Sprint is the only carrier within the 2.5Mhz band. If they're able to blanket cities with B41 towers, you will not need 600Mhz coverage. And rural coverage, well do roaming and use 800Mhz you already own.

Handsets not supporting the spectrum is not a big deal.  Once the spectrum is auctioned off if Tmobile, Verizon and AT&T all get a chunk of the 600 MHz spectrum the 3GPP will assign it an LTE band which I hope this time around should be entire 600 MHz band instead an LTE band for each sliver of 5x5 or 10x10 block.  The 3 carriers will all have to collaborate to achieve economies of scale.  I think that argument is blown out of proportion.  There is no need to worry about that at this time because it will be added on when its appropriate.  What I don't understand is why are people rehashing the zero sum game type of scenarios if Sprint were to participate in the 600 MHz auction.  I don't see people clamoring prior to today that they should not bid on the 600 MHz spectrum if Sprint was uncapable of doing both NGN and 600 MHz.  When Marcelo announced the NGN plan I didn't think for a sec that this spelled doom on the 600 MHz plan and probably nobody here.  Why can't both activities happen at the same time?

Buying out a competitor when the time comes right is not as easy as it sounds.  I just don't see what it will take for the regulators to even allow 2 national carriers to merge.  We have seen time and time again that the DOJ and other regulators come down hard when two major players try to merge.  Personally I wouldn't want to see less than 4 national carriers since we need competition.  

Perhaps I am wrong and Sprint is only making this decision based on the current circumstances of the 600 MHz auction and they know more than we do in that it truly is some huge clusterfuck that won't be of much use.  

Call me crazy if I have much higher hopes for something Sprint has had years to truly understand and finally execute on vs something that will be new and unknown and take years to be usable, I think we will have to agree to disagree.

Its just two different opinions on long term strategy.  Ultimately we both want Sprint to have a great voice/data network and really the debate is about how to best approach that solution.  I just think if you have the rare opportunities to obtain low band spectrum which time and time again we have all clamored at one point as to why Sprint did not participate in the 700 MHz auction because having low band spectrum was so crucial on expanding LTE coverage rather quickly but it was different times and circumstances so it wasn't going to be possible.  However I do question if Marcelo was at the helm in 2008 and 700 MHz was available for auction if he would do the same thing now and skip participating in that auction even if he had Masa as his backer.

At the same time here at S4GRU we have all criticized Verizon/AT&T for having a lot of low band spectrum which is great for initial LTE deployment but bad for long term capacity.  And I think Verizon/AT&T has realized that the past 2 years which is why Verizon has been focusing on obtaining more AWS mid band spectrum and AT&T beginning to deploy WCS and adding AWS spectrum to fill in the capacity needs which helps close that loop on having spectrum of all types.  Sprint and Tmobile were the other way around where they have a ton of mid band spectrum but lacked low band spectrum for coverage and it just seems so ironic that when given the opportunity to obtain some low band spectrum that they would not be chomping at the bits to try to get some of it.  Hell I don't even know why Marcelo had to release this statement at all to the rest of the wireless community.

So you were banking on 600Mhz being considerably better than Sprint's current 800Mhz? Again, I still believe adding macro sites with full builds for those situations using proven tech is still a smarter way of going about this..

No it has nothing to do with 600 MHz being considerably better than 800 MHz.  The point of having more low band spectrum is to add more capacity to share among users deep indoors.  I don't even care if 600 MHz in the real world allowed you to browse data another 100 feet vs. 800 MHz.  I think there is too much trust in this NGN plan when we have really no idea where Sprint is targeting these macro sites and small cells.  Macro sites take a gazillion years to get through approval with permits so it isn't going to be "Sprinting" any time soon anyways.  And then by the time these new macro sites are built and Sprint has some 600 MHz spectrum then it can deploy 600 MHz on these new macro sites as well as all of its current NV macro sites to provide even more coverage.

Don't get me wrong I want the NGN plan to continue to execute and I think it can do fine despite the 600 MHz auction but I just think time is what is going to be the bottleneck and not necessarily funding which has shown to be true with NV 1.0.  I don't think NV 1.0 was behind schedule due to funding but rather the red tape (permitting, backhaul delays, not enough crews, etc).  Remember once you obtain the spectrum from the FCC, it stays with the carrier forever unless they don't meet build out requirements.  But with low band spectrum that will be fairly easy to do.

I actually think of 600 MHz as another tool in the tool belt but its not going to slow down my current project.  When it comes time to use it because the current tools don't work then its time to bust it out.  Sprint is not going to obtain any 600 MHz through M&A unless it buys out Tmobile so you can forget about that happening.  It used to be easier to acquire spectrum through M&A when there were more smaller carriers but now the only other smaller carrier is US Cellular.

Tmobile has proven to be a huge force and market changer so I doubt people will be flocking in droves especially given the culture and reputation it has received the last 2 years.  People's perception has a huge impact which is why Tmobile has roared back from 34 million customers to over 55 million customers today. Really the only downside negative on Tmobile right now is their native voice and data coverage which it is addressing by obtaining 700 MHz licenses and adding more low band spectrum in the future.

That was my point, NYC is already covered super well with B41, all we need is more capacity. B41 in its current form already gets indoors pretty well without beamforming or even higher order MIMO. Also, as has been stated multiple times, 600Mhz best case scenario, the user will not experience any 600Mhz until nearly 2020 at best.

Try coming out to Los Angeles and then say the same thing.  Its easy to say that when a market is urban and things are very well tight together.  But in LA the market is so spread out that low band spectrum makes a huge difference.  

I just don't understand the thinking that if Sprint participated in 600 MHz auction that NGN efforts would go to a complete halt.  Its like the same mindset thinking back when NV was beginning to deploy that people were clamoring...just throw money at it and then NV deployment progress would suddenly rise 1000%.  That is not how it works. There are only a finite amount of network deployment staff out there that are pretty much shared between all the major carriers so throwing a ton of money isn't going to be much help and not to mention the red tape especially when all the other carriers are currently going full speed on their own LTE network deployments.

Again, Id rather they spend the 3 or 4 billion dollars(most likely more), not even including deployment cost  densifying B41. I don't know if its because I live in a very dense market, but i do not see 3G (unless super deep indoors or basement, where even verizon LTE cannot get through) is the reason I have this mindset.

 

Densifying B41 is a thousand times more forward thinking than a limited 600Mhz spectrum, that will require years and years to deploy and receive device support. If deployment of 600Mhz were doable within a year or maybe 2 it would be an ok stop gap. But even the most rural areas will continue to grow its data needs and I just don't see 10x10 (forget about 5x5) being a good long term solution for data needs especially in exchange for Band 41 deployment. 

Unless you think Sprint is hanging by a limb on cash, why can't have separate buckets for financing on spectrum auction bidding and they already have separate financing from the OEMs for the NGN network?  While the OEMs, TV stations do its thing after the 600 MHz auction, focus funds back on the NGN.  We have always said on this site that Sprint can do and have done things in parallel (LTE 800, LTE 1900 and LTE 2500 at the same time) and not serially so why not now?  BTW NYC is going to be a hell of a lot harder to cover even if you rely on 2.5 GHz small cells because that is going to take years and years to develop.  Right now Sprint is still focusing on deploying NV on all of its macro cells so you are going to be waiting on those small cells for a long time.  

Actually according to Ericcson the bottleneck for 600 MHz deployment will not be on the equipment manufacturers to produce equipment since they can do it quickly but rather the TV stations vacating the spectrum.  Actual deployment of 600 MHz will be rather quick once TV stations vacate the spectrum and will be slowly rolled out as soon as the TV network clears it which can vary.  It doesn't have to be an all or nothing deployment nationwide.

http://www.fiercewireless.com/tech/special-reports/ericsson-cto-laxdal-dishes-virtualization-network-slicing-and-600-mhz

 FWT: How quickly could you provide the equipment?

Laxdal: We'll have equipment for 600 very quickly. It's very easy for us today. We've got a 700 MHz radio, so introducing it in a 600 MHz radio is going to be very straightforward. The challenge is going to be clearing the spectrum. 600 MHz spectrum with broadcasters in it today will have to go through a clearing process, which typically could take a year and a half to two years for an operator to fully clear it. In the meantime, that doesn't mean they can't be deploying networks but they would need a clear network to be able to launch the network. So I'd say the long pole in 600 MHz will be clearing the 600 MHz spectrum and then getting the device on 600, and we will make sure the radios are available in good time.

Can't say I'm surprised by this news. Sprint needs its cash now to roll out band 41 and a more dense network. Bad timing really for Sprint. If things were different, I'd bet they would plan to participate.

I would much rather delay a little part of the NGN plan to obtain the 600 MHz now than to go press full speed with the NGN plan.  Again short term thinking is what continues to plague Sprint.  Now it begs the question if future Sprint phones will be more incompatible with the rest of the other carriers just like it does with AWS with no 600 MHz LTE band support.

FCC reserved 30Mhz for the smaller carriers..

I know its 30 MHz but that is still at least good enough for a 5x5 or 10x10 block.  Btw just because only 30 MHz is reserved doesn't mean Sprint/Tmobile would not be able to bid on the remaining 5x5 blocks of 600 MHz spectrum.  

Remember the FCC imposed rules that a carrier cannot have more than 45 MHz of <1 GHz spectrum in any particular market or something like that. In some cases if the total amount of 600 MHz available for auctions is 84 MHz, chances are Verizon/AT&T will only be able to buy a 5x5 block in that market since they own a ton of 700 MHz and 850 MHz spectrum and Sprint/Tmobile is free to bid on the remaining blocks in that region.

I hope this is a bluff because Marcelo is out of his mind if he thinks Sprint has the spectrum to compete indoors and outdoors.  Now I am feeling way less confident on his Next Generation Plan to bring the network up to par to compete with the other 3 carriers because indoor coverage will still suffer tremendously.

I know I will get a lot of flack for this, but I'm actually happy they are not. I just don't see the cost/benefit of a small 600mhz chunk that won't be usable for nearly 5 years.

Densify the hell out of B41 now, and concentrate on efforts to do CDMA shutdown/refarm as soon as possible.

How do you know the 600 MHz spectrum will just be a small chunk?  I still think its too short term thinking.  I don't see why Masa wouldn't approve of funding to get Sprint to participate in the auction.

Looks like Tmoble has started lighting up a large number of markets with their Extended Range LTE (700 MHz).  That is good news to see how the cverage is indoors.

http://s4gru.com/index.php?/blog/1/entry-398-teaser-is-s4gru-5x-certain-that-this-is-the-new-nexus-5x/

 

 

Hopefully the Nexus 6P FCC docs will be released soon.

I don't want a bump for the sake of a bump. What do you need? I need to 2GB for what I do. Some may need more, I suppose.

 

Using Tapatalk on BlackBerry Z30

2 GB is not enough for the future.  Yes running a few apps here are there is ok and is sufficient for you but most of us open a ton of apps throughout the day which bogs the system down and can definitely use the extra 1 GB of RAM.  System performance testing should consider all types of users in the spectrum including light users and heavy users.  Also wanting 3GB on a phone is not just for the sake of a bump.  Its been over 2 years since 2 GB RAM phones have been introduced so its not unreasonable.

The Nexus 6 already has 3 GB RAM so why should Google take a step back with 2 GB RAM with the 5X?  I don't think a bigger screen would suddenly warrant more RAM required for a device so Google must have had a reason it wanted to add 3 GB to the Nexus 6.  Google should be keeping the developer devices current not just for now but to be future proof.  Unless the 5X is going to be $250 with 2 GB RAM, I am sorry but I don't like all these compromises just for the sake that people want the Nexus 5X cheaper.  I would want Google to spend the max amount of money on specs to have a $400-450 range phone.

So assuming the Google store doesn't have its act together, and the phone doesn't ship with a Sprint SIM, A. can we just pop the SIM from a 2013 Nexus 5 into the new one, or B. will we have to go to a Sprint corporate store, and if so, are they going to know what to do, and will they charge?

I think the Nexus 5X and 6P is rumored to use a nano SIM while the Nexus 5 (2013) uses a micro SIM.  Don't think they are compatible.  It is usually advised to go to a Sprint corporate store and request a SIM card.  Not sure about pricing since I have not bought a Nexus device from the Play Store before.

Plus Qualcomm has been constantly mentioning how release 2 of the 810 is significantly better, the phone will probably have release 2 so hopefully a big improvement.

Actually it should be release 2.1 by now.  Even HTC confirmed in my post above that the HTC M9 which was released back in April already had rev 2.1 of the 810 chip in the phone.

I keep hearing people complain about the 810 over and over, yet no real world issues. Also, manufacturing yields improve with factory tweaking. At this point that Soc should be quite mature and probably more stable than something released today.

I guess according to the article below, Qualcomm claims the overheating issues were claimed on the revision 1 pre production units sent to OEMs for evaluation but the actual chips used in the final version in the various phones are revision 2.1 which suppose to have improved on thermal efficiency on it.  But who knows how efficient Qualcomm made it since there are claims that it had improved but still runs warm.

However they were saying that phones that are bigger provide more room for the heat to dissipate which you don't have as much luxury on the smaller 5 inch flagships.  Either way I think everyone agrees that despite the efficiencies that were made to the 810 chip rev 2.1, it was still a failed chip overall.  I hope Huawei and Google have fine tuned the software and hardware to make improvements on top of what Qualcomm has already done with the latest rev 2.1 chip.

http://www.androidcentral.com/htc-one-m9-already-using-snapdragon-810-v21

Hopefully Qualcomm comes back with the 820 chip to build trust again with their high end chips.

It would be interesting to see if the Nexus 6P will have the 3500 maH battery as is rumored.  That will definitely get me thinking about the 6P but the Snapdragon 810 chip does have me a bit worried unless Qualcomm has somehow addressed the issues that the big OEMs LG and Samsung have complained about huge power consumption earlier this year.

I don't use a case.

How can you not wear protection.

I'm on the fence. If there is only $100 difference between the 5X and 6P (like the upgrade to the 6s Plus), then I will have a dillemma. If it is $250 or more difference, then it is highly unlikely I would go with the 6P.

 

I think all things considered, I like the 5X and 6P equally. The 5X form factor, but the 6P specs. But if the 6P is the better RF performer or a better device for enthusiasts, I would go 6P in a heartbeat over the 5X. And I don't even dislike the bulge treatment on the back of the 6P.

So basically < $250 diff is a no brainer for the 6P assuming strong RF real world results and phone performance. Yeah I guess I am starting to warm up to a possibility of the 6P assuming the form factor isn't so bulky. I am glad Google this time around realized the 6 inch size is just a tad too big. I always though the 5.5-5.7 inch form factor is the perfect size for the phablet domain.

Just curious since it seems the Nexus 5X has gotten the most attention, is anyone here considering the Nexus 6P as a choice if for some reason the Nexus 5X disappoints?  Depending on what is announced on the 29th,

I might have to wait to see and play with both the 5X and 6P devices in person to see if it the 6P could be viable for me especially if they can make the 5.7 in screen in a smaller profile than the Note 5.  I have been biased towards the 5X phone since it has the same screen size as the LG G2 which I love but it seems like each leak that is released makes it a weaker speced phone.

If 3000 maH, 1440p, and 3 GB is what you want then the Moto X sounds like the perfect phone for you. I am still leaning that way myself actually but I want to see some comparison reviews between the two before I buy.

I am not too concerned about the 1440p screen anymore and to a certain extent the 2700 maH battery.  I can live with 1080p.  I would much rather have 3 GB RAM and a larger base storage size (32 GB base with 64 GB option).

Honestly, if they made the Moto Nexus 6 with a 5" screen, it'd be perfect for me.  I hate that to get a flagship phone with a 5" screen size, you're having to compromise on a number of things.

I guess the question for you is, do you fall in the camp where you would rather have a fully high end speced phone and pay $649 for base model like the Nexus 6 did or would you rather have a lower cost Nexus like the Nexus 5 and have to compromise on things.  Either way there are disadvantages.  It sounds like from your response you don't mind paying the $649 for the Nexus 6 if the screen was just 5 inches.

Personally for me I hated that $649 price tag since it was too rich and Id rather have a lower priced Nexus phone.  However if $400 gives me these specs from the leak, I would rather pay another $50 bucks ($450 based) to improve on some of the specs like the RAM/storage size.

I still am expecting 3 GB of ram and 16/32 GB ram storage sizes. I am a little skeptical of that leak as it lists the weight at 175g which is as heavy as Samsung's Note line with much bigger screens and battery. I still think it will come with 3 GB of ram.

 

I'll have to see how the battery life compares to the Moto X pure.

 

Edit: actually looking at the sizing specs the amazon india links listed I think they got some specs for the Nexus P intermixed as the size looks like it would be for a 5.7" phone in which case the weight makes sense

3GB is a necessary upgrade imo. My Moto G has 2GB of RAM and it's considered mid-tier.

 

I'm hoping the specs are off. Battery is kind of little too but we'll see.

 

Sent from my M8

I hope the leaked specs are wrong in the RAM and storage size department. I would be disappointed in 2 GB RAM since I think 3 GB RAM is good enough.  32 GB storage should be the base model with 32 GB and 64 GB storage options.

I know people want lower costs on Nexus phones but I hate these trade offs.  I would rather pay a bit more so that certain corners are not cut just to ensure a decent spec phone.  The rest of the specs of non 1440p screen resolution and battery of 2700 maH, I have come to accept even though I much prefer at least a 3000 maH battery and the 1440p screen.