4ringsnbr

I don't know that DO Advanced will do anything to the 1x carrier associations. It may, but as far as I know (based upon Qualcomm's limited publications) it only allows the network to switch your EV carrier-- there's no indication that it will affect your 1x carrier for phone calls.

Less likely, but not fool proof. However, due to network load balancing, you can get shifted to another site without moving an inch. Happens all the time. And if you are being pushed off to a legacy site from a NV site, on the same channel in Chicago, you are likely to be dropped. But the chances go way up when you are mobile.Robert

Robert, this is CDMA, not GSM! On CDMA, the handset controls the handoff entirely. The only thing the tower can do on CDMA is command the handset to reduce the transmit power when the handset is too close to the tower to rectify the near-far problem. DO Advanced will allow the network to finally force your handset to switch EV sectors/towers. For now, your handset will always pick the sector with the best Ec/Io. It can also hook up to 2 or more sectors simultaneously. When it switches, the network FOLLOWS it, never commands it to switch.

Agreed. If they installed all the radios, cabinets, antennas, etc for 3G, why not just complete the entire tower site with 4G as well.

I'm afraid some of you (especially those in Boston) have stumbled onto the dirty little secret with network vision. The 4G LTE and eHRPD network (where EVDO will connect also) will be using new NV backhaul. The old 1x / EVDO (but non-eHRPD linked) network will use the old, existing backhaul and network. This is why the radios may be done, but there is no PDN gateway to tie LTE and eHRPD into. What this means in those areas is that 3G only phones will continue to see the same relative network performance after the NV upgrade; however, LTE-equipped phones connecting to 3G (via eHRPD) or LTE will use the higher capacity backhaul network tied to the PDN gateway.

I think that if they use clearwire's spectrum right and deploy that spectrum in small cells, they will never have capacity issues. That 150mhz should really make the problem more of a backhaul issue than a spectrum issue. With 150 mhz, they can deploy seven 10x10 LTE channels and two 5x5 channels which along with its short range, (actually a strength for this purpose), essentially make spectrum constraints a non-issue. I just can't see that many people packed in such a small space that more carriers would be necessary. Even if they were, they could break up that spectrum into 53 1.4x1.4 channels. For less dense urban and rural areas the 1900 and 800 will fill the rest of the demand. All Sprint has to do is look at where today's hotspots are then deploy a 2.5ghz small cell to it.It would mean no more dropped calls at the Texas State fair, near theoretical maximum speeds at CES, and more importantly no more 250kbps "3G" speeds everywhere else.

The 2.5 GHz spectrum is not frequency divided-- there are no separate uplink and downlink channels-- a 1.4x1.4 or 10x10 or any such type of carrier is not possible here. Only TD-LTE (time duplexed) can be done here. This means a 20 MHz channel can be divided (in time) between up and down time slices-- but the same channel is used for both. The duplex is done like WiFi or WiMax today: 10 ms of upload, a 1 ms "guard", then 20 ms of download for example would be a 1:2 up/down TD-LTE channel.

One peculiarity with this phone as compared with all other Sprint ESMR handsets I've noticed. Every other handset has been approved from 817.9 - 823.1 MHz (channels 476 - 684). The HTC EVO LTE was approved only up to 822.75 MHz (channel 670). It would not be capable of using EVDO/1xA (CDMA) channel 676 should Sprint ever deploy a carrier here, although every other ESMR-enabled handset would.

Any word on SVDO support on all Sprint 2012 handsets? That would be a nice feature to have so that way ATT cannot make fun of Verizon and Sprint for not being able to talk and surf on 3G with CDMA.

The LG Viper does do SVDO. None of the other handsets do. The Viper will join HTC's Thunderbolt and Rezound as the only SVDO handsets in North America. Implementing SVDO requires 2 CDMA baseband processors. It appears the EVO will rely on the single CDMA baseband built into its S4 SoC processor so no SVDO, but SVLTE should be supported.

4rings..when was this LG LS-831 phone FCC approved? I hope this is not the phone that will be launched this fall. I want that Windows Phone in the fall to have LTE service as well as the Windows Phone Apollo OS preinstalled.Edit: It looks like this was approved back in Oct 2011. Seems like such a long time to be released after being approved about 6 months ago. Hopefully it gets launched soon.

The LS-696 was approved in January a week after the Viper and it is 3G only. Sprint will continue to launch 3G only phones. I wouldn't expect ALL phones to be 4G LTE for another year or 2 at least. Some people DON'T want 4G phones with the battery drain.

For Windows Phone fans, a new Sprint Windows Phone is on the way. The LG LS-831 was FCC certified for CDMA/EVDO operation in ESMR 800 / Cellular 850 / PCS 1900 bands. It has WiFi & Bluetooth. It does NOT have LTE or WiMax -- it is 3G only.

Naturally, they don't want to let their product do the talking, they have to use every possible way to make it impossible for their competitors to do business.

AT&T and VZW had nothing to do with the band class split-- the FCC decided upon the duplex pairing by recommendations when they went to auction. The regulations are currently the limitation on the hardware.

Phone manufacturers are in business to make money-- they want to sell the most devices they can at the most profit, so if they can make a device that'll work with everyone's network and be able to obtain FCC approval, they'll make it as long as it doesn't cost more to produce than they can sell it for. The carriers won't care as long as it supports their network and band class. Look at the LG Viper-- they made one model with a PCS (BC 25) LTE antenna for Sprint and a duplicate model with a different antenna but all other components the same for Metro PCS. All OEMs do this-- they make the most interchangeable devices they can that will meet regulatory requirements.

Agreed, band class 13/14 (Upper 700 MHz) and band class 12/17 (Lower 700 MHz) will remain separate because of the duplex inversion.The perfectly solvable problem is VZW and/or AT&T throwing around their anti competitive clout to get OEMs to build devices that are band class 17 (instead of the original, inclusive band class 12), band class 2 (instead of the superset band class 25), or band class 5 (instead of the superset band class 26).Those are little more than predatory, exclusionary practices designed to squeeze out the competitive carriers by making it more difficult for them to procure compatible devices and nary impossible for subs to churn and take their VZW or AT&T devices to other carriers.AJ

When was band class 26 approved? I only see 1-25 and the TDD classes 33-43 on the official lists... The other question is will the FCC allow a superset of ESMR and cellular since the two bands are governed by different rules (part 90S vs. 22H), which impacts power output limitations that would have to be enforced in some manner.

As the FCC turns its attention to interoperability concerns, VZW and AT&T should not and will not be allowed to continue their parochial, predatory practices to prevent interoperability and stymie competition.

I have seen reports that the FCC is looking into why phones cannot use LTE BC 12 in lieu of BC 17. Band 12 (regional carriers) is a superset of Band 17 (AT&T). I see no reason why these two band classes have to be separate.

I don't see any way they can do anything about BC 13, however. It is backwards (uplink frequencies higher than downlink frequencies) in addition to having a different duplex spacing (-31 instead of +30 MHz).

I think that the next iPhone will be larger and have a different profile than the current iPhone. If they can fit 4, I'm left to believe they could fit a 5th or 6th if necessary. Two of these bands are doubled up on each antenna. Can they be tripled up? Maybe so.Robert

Just remember that the size of the antenna, and for EVDO, 1xA, & LTE Rx diversity or MIMO, the spacing between the two receive antennas is proportional to the wavelength of the frequency band. The lower the frequency, the larger the antenna (and space needed). This may be why all 700 LTE phones are huge! A quick approximation of the wavelength is λ = 300 / f, where f = frequency (in MHz) and λ = wavelength in meters. Typically a quarter wave antenna is favored, where the optimal antenna length is 1/4 the wavelength.

More important to me than knowing what LTE bands may or may not be supported (at least for the next 2-3 years) is will this iPhone support CDMA in ESMR-- it is a PHONE after all, and if you want to call people, this would be beneficial for Sprint. Unfortunately, there has been no indication that Apple is interested in supporting an unusual band (ESMR), even for CDMA use (which is approved).

According to this sketch, they're trying to support LTE bands 1, 2, 4, 5, 8, 13, & 17 with a single phone. Slight problem: band class 2 is PCS blocks A-F only; band class 25 is needed to support the G block. Also, band class 5 is Cellular 850-- it does not include ESMR 800. Band class 4 is AWS. I think 8 is European 900 Cellular and 1 is MSS. LTE band 13 is Verizon and 17 is AT&T (but not the regionals that use BC 12).

Wow! It looks like North Mississippi along I-22 is going straight from 1x to LTE! It will leave those folks wondering what the 3G buzz was all about the past decade.

Sgt., an upcoming USCC Samsung handset supports CDMA1X/EV-DO 850/1900 + LTE 700/850/1900/2100+1700 (i.e. AWS).AJ

Where's the 2nd Rx antenna for EVDO diversity on 850 & 1900? Maybe it shares the LTE 2nd Rx antenna for that? The antenna spacing (and space allowed for such) will be a significant issue for compact handsets for some time to come.

hmm-- new SIDs and channel numbers.... shall I?!?

i don't pay for 5gb of data from Verizon Fios for my home internet, i get unlimited, as does ANYONE WITH ANY HOME INTERNET... data is data,

Nope-- MOST ISPs do have a monthly cap (some soft some hard). AT&T U-Verse is 200GB / mo. Cox has 250GB / mo. Just about everyone has limits...

But to the point of the iPad on Lte... Mobile broadband is not sustainable for this kind of use. Mobile broadband is intended to provide data when you're away from home-- it was never expected to replace a wired (DSL / Cable) internet link with WiFi in your own home for heavy use like watching movies, etc. There simply isn't enough airspace for EVERYONE to use Mobile broadband rather than a landline for data at home. Now at work, on the go, when on vacation or away from home, I would expect to rely on mobile broadband, but I'd rarely expect to use heavy media during these times. The most mobile data I've ever been able to use was 1.6 GB in a single month, and I used to think that was due to Sprint's pathetic speeds, but since on Verizon, I'm only using about 600 MB / month of my 4GB allowance and I know with the consistent 40 mbps speeds, I could easily burn through more, but I just don't see doing heavy media on my phone.

I'd say first and foremost the Marketing staff is the best in the business...When you can lure customers in with things like, +70Mbps LTE speeds like they did with the new iPad and get away with it....pure genius...no one else states the technologies theoretical top speed except them...Also, calling a display "Retina" when its not really more than what the human retina can see was genius...Without their marketing department they would fail big time as many would realize over time all the features Android has over iOS...They win in Display and battery life imho...but you gotta figure that only reason their battery life is what it is, is b/c of how basic and simple iOS is compared to other OS's...

The primary reason for iPhone's better battery life is the small screen size. The greatest battery drain on any phone is the display. As the diagonal screen size goes up, the area goes up even more (it is a squared relationship)... i.e. a 4.3" vs. a 3.5" screen has 50.9% more area to power. As soon as the iPhones have decent size screens, their battery life will plummet.

I will say this, if Robert is teasing us over the lg viper then I am gonna be pissed. LOL.

The LG Viper was approved by the FCC back on January 9. It should've been made available before the Galaxy Nexus, but all manufacturers have different factory schedules. Apple doesn't submit its new iPhones for approval generally until the day of release to prevent any pre-release info getting out. They run all the tests and hold for the FCC filing until launch day.

I tested my Driod RaZR MAXX on eHRPD after turning off the LTE radio and I get 2.5 megabits down during the middle of the day here in NYC. I am keeping my EVO with Sprint to preserve the unlimited data plan, but if Sprint get rid of it I will be done with them. With Verizon you get what you pay for.

That's typical VZW eHRPD/EVDO performance I see too. LTE has improved lately-- was averaging 25/13 mpbs last month. Now averaging 33/15 mbps. No complaints here! Sprint here runs about 200 kbps if you're lucky. The pings on Sprint's 3G are close to the downloads (kbps) on VZW 3G here, and vice-versa.

MetroPCS does use SIM cards for their LTE. I'm in the new/used phone resell/refurbishing business and have a few Metro 4G phones we're having issues selling. The issue with them is the previous customer kept their last 4G SIM card, and MetroPCS requires them to activate the phones as a used phone. Metro does not provide the customer any SIM card unless they buy the phone directly from them or have the SIM card previously used in that phone. The SIM cards are also not available for sale on ebay or any other website for that matter.It is a disappointment that MetroPCS does this as it could lead to customers leaving due to such a restriction on their services. Verizon, as far as I know, does not offer SIM cards to customers either, but their SIM cards can be found and purchased on eBay as I have done so in the past.I don't mind Sprint following the SIM card LTE service, as long as its either not removable, or they are available for the consumer in the "aftermarket" so they may purchase a replacement phone for a lower price on ebay/craigslist as opposed to paying full retail price in the store.

When you sign up a new line of service or first move to a 4G device, Verizon gives you a SIM card. After that, when you buy a phone, you only get the phone-- you "activate" the new phone by taking your SIM out of your old phone and putting it into the new one. You'll only get a different SIM if yours is broken somehow or lost. People moving from older mini-SIMs (used in HTC phones & older droids) to newer micro-SIM phones (GNex, RAZR, RAZR MAXX, Droid 4) can request a new SIM if they don't want to clip their existing SIM to use.

Don't fear eHRPD. When they have an authentication issue or LTE outage-- it's that gateway that is an issue. The phone looks for eHRPD as a fallback and within 30 seconds or so it will switch over to EVDO instead. Good old EVDO still works on the phone, and in the tower you have essentially two different networks (gateways): one set that is LTE / eHRPD with the other set EVDO/1x/CDMA. eHRPD is just EVDO air interface tied into the LTE gateway IP network. There is nothing to fear but fear itself!

According to anandtech, the Verizon Galaxy nexus uses the Samsung CMC221 with FCI FC7851. I doubt Sprint would get a different version (but maybe they will).

That's the LTE baseband and preamp/LNA. The issue is that the Verizon version's CDMA baseband doesn't support 1xAdvanced. Right now, only the Qualcomm chips do. This means they would have to change the CDMA baseband, and the MDM9600 is the most common one used curently, which also does LTE. They might also be able to use one of the newer QSC chips that will do CDMA 1xA, which is a possibility to retain their own LTE baseband. It would be better actually if they go that route so that everyone will same more battery life running in 3G only mode, which most people do with smaller than 2500 mAh batteries.

The lack of SVDO support is due to using the TI OMAP processor (SoC). The radio baseband used is likely a Qualcomm MDM9600 (like the Rezound, Thunderbolt, iPad3, etc.), which will do CDMA/EVDO/LTE of just about any form. The problem is there is only a single CDMA baseband (and a single LTE baseband). The antenna and "antenna paths" can be shared with no issue. The previously approved LG Viper DOES do SVDO because it undoubtedly uses a Qualcomm SoC processor (Snapdragon S3) with a built-in CDMA baseband along with the MDM9600's. The TWO basebands share the antenna arrays to allow for SVDO usage.