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T-Mobile LTE & Network Discussion V2

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LAA action in NYC..
 
 
Well let's see that progress in central New Jersey. I'm only 45 minutes away so I don't see what the big deal is why they can't deploy here too.

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20 minutes ago, danlodish345 said:

But phone carriers will not get priority?

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Well actually, since LAA requires licensed spectrum for the control signals, they will use 5GHz in completion with WiFi users. Cable cos can only use LAA if they rent licensed spectrum from cellular carriers. Now since Comcast has 600Mhz spectrum they might use it for LAA.

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Well actually, since LAA requires licensed spectrum for the control signals, they will use 5GHz in completion with WiFi users. Cable cos can only use LAA if they rent licensed spectrum from cellular carriers. Now since Comcast has 600Mhz spectrum they might use it for LAA.
Hmm I didnt know it worked that way...but I m impatienntly waiting for it to bw deployed here..

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It will be interesting to see how LAA works with LinkNYC. I hope there isn’t any interference and everything is properly vetted in that regard, especially since LinkNYC is obscenely fast.


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1 hour ago, Fraydog said:

It will be interesting to see how LAA works with LinkNYC. I hope there isn’t any interference and everything is properly vetted in that regard, especially since LinkNYC is obscenely fast.


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They will have to share. LAA has a listen before transmit feature to avoid interference.

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They will have to share. LAA has a listen before transmit feature to avoid interference.
Is interference punishable by fines?

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1 minute ago, bigsnake49 said:

They will have to share. LAA has a listen before transmit feature to avoid interference.

They will have to be pretty methodical where they deploy it. I'm also sure during rush hour speeds will not be anywhere near this considering how much competing 2.4 they will have to contend with.

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11 minutes ago, danlodish345 said:

Is interference punishable by fines?

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Yes and removal of offending equipment if they can't be fixed.

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Yes and removal of offending equipment if they can't be fixed.
That is pretty harsh. Can't the FCC seize their equipment if it came to that?

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They will have to be pretty methodical where they deploy it. I'm also sure during rush hour speeds will not be anywhere near this considering how much competing 2.4 they will have to contend with.


B46 uses 5Ghz spectrum. Not 2.4.

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B46 uses 5Ghz spectrum. Not 2.4.
I have the lgv30. I believe that's compatible.

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11 minutes ago, WiseGuy321 said:

 


B46 uses 5Ghz spectrum. Not 2.4.

 

My bad yes 5ghz..

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I have the lgv30. I believe that's compatible.

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LTE B2/B4/B5/B12/B46/B66/B71 on the V30 and V30+

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Neville Ray basically admitted that their 5G network won't be their main network for the foreseeable future. 5G NR is going to be deployed on 600MHz and the mmWave holdings. mmWave will be deployed much like a hotspot and 600MHz will be for breadth of coverage like in rural areas. According to Neville, 5G NR has something like 20-30% spectral efficiency over LTE at 600MHz so it'll give greater speeds than LTE but it won't be a game changer like Sprint's 160MHz of 2.5/2.6GHz will be. Additionally LAA, like mmWave, will likely only be deployed on small cells in high traffic areas as a way to boost the network.

5G and gigabit LTE will live side by side for a very long time. Watching carriers announce their plans for deployment is way more interesting than during the early days of LTE.

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LTE B2/B4/B5/B12/B46/B66/B71 on the V30 and V30+

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I can definitely tell you where I live T-Mobile needs the extra capacity.

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Neville Ray basically admitted that their 5G network won't be their main network for the foreseeable future. 5G NR is going to be deployed on 600MHz and the mmWave holdings. mmWave will be deployed much like a hotspot and 600MHz will be for breadth of coverage like in rural areas. According to Neville, 5G NR has something like 20-30% spectral efficiency over LTE at 600MHz so it'll give greater speeds than LTE but it won't be a game changer like Sprint's 160MHz of 2.5/2.6GHz will be. Additionally LAA, like mmWave, will likely only be deployed on small cells in high traffic areas as a way to boost the network.

5G and gigabit LTE will live side by side for a very long time. Watching carriers announce their plans for deployment is way more interesting than during the early days of LTE.

 

5G has caused so much total stupidity in this industry. Look back at the 4G LTE rollouts. Verizon and AT&T pushed hard early on rural 4G in 700 MHz spectrum. This approach in the early days of LTE was ludicrously successful. Verizon and AT&T pulled away from their smaller competitors. Only when T-Mobile got 700 MHz and started expanding out of cities did their customer numbers really start to change. Sprint largely stuck in their existing footprint.

 

Now we have AT&T and Verizon focusing on mmWave. Focused on urban and the exception like AT&T’s Waco adventure. Meanwhile T-Mobile talks up using 5G NR on 600 MHz spectrum.

 

Where I live, mmWave isn’t going to be worth a you know what. Even 2600 isn’t great in the rural areas where it is, which I don’t live in since Sprint decided to not cover my town. Now Verizon and AT&T want to use mmWave as their key 5G strategy. At least Sprint has plenty of 2600 to burn. That’s nice for small cells in downtowns of small cells for 5G but I don’t see how that will be great outside that for rural areas.

 

Suddenly, where I sit, T-Mobile looks like they have the best rural 5G strategy. Five years ago, this would have been unthinkable. This is seriously making me wonder what parallel universe I’m in.

 

 

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10 hours ago, Fraydog said:

At least Sprint has plenty of 2600 to burn. That’s nice for small cells in downtowns of small cells for 5G but I don’t see how that will be great outside that for rural areas.

Specifically targeting this point, Sprint's Band 41 deployment is more than just small cells though. That's what makes it great for 5G. While mmWave is great for small cells and 600MHz will be useful for macros and greater coverage, Sprint could leverage both macros and small cells in the future to provide dense urban and suburban 5G coverage over 100MHz+ of spectrum and simultaneously offer gigabit LTE using 4x4MIMO, 256QAM, and FD/TDD-LTE carrier aggregation. *Of course these are all hypotheticals.*

Who knows, maybe in the future Sprint will decide to pursue rural deployment of Band 41. That said, I am completely understanding of how T-Mobile's plan is the best strategy to you.

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Something else that is interesting to note is Nokia recently demonstrated (in Europe) how massive MIMO could bring the coverage of 3500 MHz spectrum to that of 1800 MHz spectrum. I wonder what massive MIMO will be able to do for Sprint’s 2500/2600 MHz spectrum. Maybe it will make rural n41 deployment possible…

EDIT: Meant Nokia not Qualcomm

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Something else that is interesting to note is Qualcomm recently demonstrated (in Europe) how massive MIMO could bring the coverage of 3500 MHz spectrum to that of 1800 MHz spectrum. I wonder what massive MIMO will be able to do for Sprint’s 2500/2600 MHz spectrum. Maybe it will make rural n41 deployment possible…


Even if that doesn’t yield much of a gain, 2600 is still going to get better results in rural than mmWave. Now I’m not going to claim it would make 2600 like 600, but it’s pretty clear that 2600 is at least deployable in some rural cases.


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3 minutes ago, Fraydog said:

 


Even if that doesn’t yield much of a gain, 2600 is still going to get better results in rural than mmWave. Now I’m not going to claim it would make 2600 like 600, but it’s pretty clear that 2600 is at least deployable in some rural cases.


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I’d estimate that with massive MIMO and HPUE, 2500/2600 MHz NR could probably eclipse the range of L1900 today. 

See page 29 here regarding my previous post: http://www.oulu.fi/sites/default/files/content/Keskinen-5Glecture.pdf

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I am very confident that most of 5G/LTE expansion will be in the CBRS band, the 3.7-4.2 GHz band and the 5GHz band (LAA). Plenty of spectrum to be had there. If I am Sprint I cozy up to the cable cos on LAA with strand and pole mounted small cells that also accommodate band 41. Win-win situation.

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1 hour ago, bigsnake49 said:

I am very confident that most of 5G/LTE expansion will be in the CBRS band, the 3.7-4.2 GHz band and the 5GHz band (LAA). Plenty of spectrum to be had there. If I am Sprint I cozy up to the cable cos on LAA with strand and pole mounted small cells that also accommodate band 41. Win-win situation.

Yup, I'm thinking CBRS might be the "global" 5G band along with EBS/BRS for East Asia. I hope Sprint is eyeing some of that CBRS for roaming synergies.

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ironic I maybe heading to east aisa in a year and a half

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On 3/5/2018 at 8:55 AM, Paynefanbro said:

Yup, I'm thinking CBRS might be the "global" 5G band along with EBS/BRS for East Asia. I hope Sprint is eyeing some of that CBRS for roaming synergies.

I think it would be great if Sprint could pick some spectrum in the CBRS band—I could definitely see their NR network being primarily 2.5/3.5 GHz. Additionally, if CBRS spectrum were used for NR with massive MIMO, it would be a good overlay for the L1900 grid as it would have comparable coverage/range. 

Your point about roaming is definitely true too. It would be nice for us to roam in other countries on the same band as back home; additionally, with spectrum that lines up with international providers, Sprint may be able to break into the US international roaming market (which AT&T and T-Mobile primarily dominate today). 

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I think it would be great if Sprint could pick some spectrum in the CBRS band—I could definitely see their NR network being primarily 2.5/3.5 GHz. Additionally, if CBRS spectrum were used for NR with massive MIMO, it would be a good overlay for the L1900 grid as it would have comparable coverage/range. 
Your point about roaming is definitely true too. It would be nice for us to roam in other countries on the same band as back home; additionally, with spectrum that lines up with international providers, Sprint may be able to break into the US international roaming market (which AT&T and T-Mobile primarily dominate today). 


As it is, it’s time for Sprint to be active in spectrum auctions again. mmWave and CBRS are all needed.


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