T-Mobile LTE & Network Discussion V2

[Terrell352]

They know how to do marketing, and they market themselves as the cool kid. People want to hang out with the cool kids not with the boring ones(Sprint etc)

 

Personally I don;t like Legere,but he knows a lot about marketing. He has used marketing tools, ( Uncarrier 1-10, BingON etc to gives the company momentum until they have a superior network and take out Sprint.

 

Let's be clear here, Tmobile will never touch Verizon and AT&T, but Sprint is vulnerable. Sprint mostly customers losses go to Tmobile.

I wonder how much longer they can survive without each other?

 

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[Fraydog]

Verizon and AT&T both have super large debts in range of $100 billion. That makes them a little more vulnerable than they would be in the past. Where in the past they could expand their networks, lower prices, and basically use all their tools to crush T-Mobile and Sprint, now they have to be more judicious and maintain profit and dividend even if it means shedding low quality customers. AT&T and Verizon could reduce the dividends but their institutional investors would punish them HARD. AT&T announces this afternoon IIRC, so it will be interesting to see what their earnings are.

 

And here's the thing about T-Mobile's rural coverage... it isn't the highest quality on coverage but it is excellent for data hotspot. Not many customers means that coverage is usually really fast where the duopoly will usually be content with B12/B13 with some hotspots of B4/B2 tossed in. There's definitely needs that it fulfills. Cheap data for a hotspot is a need us rural folks have. People should look at T-Mobile for that, and I'd say the same for Sprint if they had more B41 in rural.

 

To really close the gap, though, T-Mobile has to increase capital expenditures. Truth is, Neville Ray has done an excellent job on a shoestring budget. However, the gap can't really close unless capex goes way up. If capex went back up, that would eat into if not take away T-Mo's profitability. T-Mobile isn't going to be able to cut into the massive M2M and corporate contracts the duopoly has unless they really equal coverage.

 

That's the juggling act T-Mobile faces. The ultimate solution to that is SCALE. However there isn't really a lot of options for that anymore and the FCC seems dead set on four providers. It isn't like T-Mobile is going to have the option to buy out Sprint unless the FCC has a change of heart.

[NYC126]

Verizon and AT&T both have super large debts in range of $100 billion. That makes them a little more vulnerable than they would be in the past. Where in the past they could expand their networks, lower prices, and basically use all their tools to crush T-Mobile and Sprint, now they have to be more judicious and maintain profit and dividend even if it means shedding low quality customers. AT&T and Verizon could reduce the dividends but their institutional investors would punish them HARD. AT&T announces this afternoon IIRC, so it will be interesting to see what their earnings are. 

 

And here's the thing about T-Mobile's rural coverage... it isn't the highest quality on coverage but it is excellent for data hotspot. Not many customers means that coverage is usually really fast where the duopoly will usually be content with B12/B13 with some hotspots of B4/B2 tossed in. There's definitely needs that it fulfills. Cheap data for a hotspot is a need us rural folks have. People should look at T-Mobile for that, and I'd say the same for Sprint if they had more B41 in rural. 

 

To really close the gap, though, T-Mobile has to increase capital expenditures. Truth is, Neville Ray has done an excellent job on a shoestring budget. However, the gap can't really close unless capex goes way up. If capex went back up, that would eat into if not take away T-Mo's profitability. 

 

That's the juggling act T-Mobile faces. The ultimate solution to that is SCALE. However there isn't really a lot of options for that anymore and the FCC seems dead set on four providers. It isn't like T-Mobile is going to have the option to buy out Sprint unless the FCC has a change of heart. 

They wont be a threat to the Duopoly with a 1.3 billions on Capex per quarter. Hell they even spend less than Sprint on network, but for some reason they get better results. 

[Fraydog]

They wont be a threat to the Duopoly with a 1.3 billions on Capex per quarter. Hell they even spend less than Sprint on network, but for some reason they get better results. 

 

 

Neville is a huge part of that along with the rest of the team he built there. That said, there's only so much they can do to cheat physics. I'm sure some will construe my comments as taking shots at T-Mobile, but it really isn't considering I have been very complementary of their network team, heck Legere too when it comes to the operations end. 

 

That said, there's still the Germans. There have been rumblings they are happier with their investment now, but if there's the right offer on table... To be honest, now that Charter has sucked up TWC, that is a match up that could make sense. 

 

On another note, T-Mobile must be doing some sort of densification in St. Louis. I was getting in building coverage in quite a few buildings with T-Mobile with an old iPhone 5S that I had in hotspot mode that I wasn't getting with a Note 5 on Verizon that has served as my daily driver the last six months. Verizon has low band there and T-Mobile doesn't. Yet Verizon wins RootMetrics in the St. Louis testing. I wonder if Root did a lot of in building testing here. 

[Rawvega]

 

 

Their churn is 1.33% higher compared to the twin bells, but it seems most of the customers they are taking are coming from Sprint. ATT and Verizon profits are hardly impacted.

 

Au contraire mon frere.

 

https://twitter.com/WaltBTIG/status/724950414089682945

 

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[derrph]

Au contraire mon frere.

 

https://twitter.com/WaltBTIG/status/724950414089682945

 

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Looks like most of their new customers came from AT&T. Sprint was in line with Verizon.

 

 

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[Paynefanbro]

 

Au contraire mon frere.

 

https://twitter.com/WaltBTIG/status/724950414089682945

 

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Sprint's quick drop in porting ratio from #1 to basically in line with Verizon says a lot about how Sprint has improved to the point where T-Mobile isn't as much a threat as they used to be.

[Deval]

Sprint's quick drop in porting ratio from #1 to basically in line with Verizon says a lot about how Sprint has improved to the point where T-Mobile isn't as much a threat as they used to be.

 

Also speaks volumes to the simplified pricing promos that Sprint has now.

[NYC126]

Au contraire mon frere. https://twitter.com/WaltBTIG/status/724950414089682945

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Good.

[Fraydog]

The best quip in the call was John Legere more or less shifting the dumber slot from AT&T to Verizon. I will admit I laughed at that part. My gut instinct is that AT&T is getting smarter about competing by converging services and Verizon thinks they can compete over the top with Netflix. Good luck with that.

 

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[Overstew]

Sprint's quick drop in porting ratio from #1 to basically in line with Verizon says a lot about how Sprint has improved to the point where T-Mobile isn't as much a threat as they used to be.

And this includes MetroPCS numbers, which specifically targeted Sprint. Not bad at all.

[NYC126]

The best quip in the call was John Legere more or less shifting the dumber slot from AT&T to Verizon. I will admit I laughed at that part. My gut instinct is that AT&T is getting smarter about competing by converging services and Verizon thinks they can compete over the top with Netflix. Good luck with that.

 

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Verizon is run by people that think short term, They should spend their resources on FIOS buildout. With Streaming services kicking into high gear, fiber to the home is  the new frontier.

[tyroned3222]

T mobile hinted at 4×4 mimo and 3 way carrier aggregation. Will we need a new device for this

 

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[tybo31316]

T mobile hinted at 4×4 mimo and 3 way carrier aggregation. Will we need a new device for this

 

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I'm almost positive you will.

 

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[Paynefanbro]

The also mentioned that the LTE-U small cells that they wanted to use are giving them trouble.

[Houston_Texas]

1,000,000 post paid customers

 

Impressive.

 

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[Overstew]

Going to be over 70M customers by the end of 2016. That, to me is crazy! T-Mobile is definitely earning its share of the market with its game-changing industry moves. I have been trying out T-Mobile in Jacksonville with my second line and it is working really well. I haven't tried Verizon or AT&T but I believe T-Mobile may function just as well as, if not better than the big two because I am on LTE 99% of the time, and when I'm not, it's still a very usable HSPA connection.

 

May just move everyone over soon because having voice+data at the same time is useful for my wife who is a realtor.

Edited April 27, 2016 by Overstew

[Houston_Texas]

 

 

Going to be over 70M customers by the end of 2016. That, to me is crazy! T-Mobile is definitely earning its share of the market with its game-changing industry moves. I have been trying out T-Mobile in Jacksonville with my second line and it is working really well. I haven't tried Verizon or AT&T but I believe T-Mobile may function just as well as, if not better than the big two because I am on LTE 99% of the time, and when I'm not, it's still a very usable HSPA connection.

 

May just move everyone over soon because having voice+data at the same time is useful for my wife who is a realtor.

Simultaneous voice and data is a great feature!

 

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[JeffDTD]

The porting ratios are representative of the incentives available. Besides unlimited data/direct tv bundle, verizon and sprint are offering better value on shared data and better promoted/understood acquisition and retention promotions than ATT. Customers arent flocking from ATT to tmo for the network.. Its the price

 

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[Arysyn]

The porting ratios are representative of the incentives available. Besides unlimited data/direct tv bundle, verizon and sprint are offering better value on shared data and better promoted/understood acquisition and retention promotions than ATT. Customers arent flocking from ATT to tmo for the network.. Its the price

 

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I would imagine mostly for the promotional deals and the cheap 6gb data only plan, which isn't saying much as T-Mobile has raised prices elsewhere. Sprint needs to do something more innovative than "50% off", along with delivering positive customer service changes, then perhaps Sprint will gain a lot of customers too. The network mostly is there, just with a few other changes Sprint will be set.

[JeffDTD]

Sprint needs to do something more innovative than "50% off", along with delivering positive customer service changes, then perhaps Sprint will gain a lot of customers too. The network mostly is there, just with a few other changes Sprint will be set.

Does your definition or "more innovative" mean cheaper or more gimmicks/freebies at higher prices? With unlimited available for as little as $37.50 a line on a family plan, its hard to appreciate how we can discuss health of the company and any reduction in pricing. I actually admire tmo's ability to raise pricing and reduce bucket sizes by successfully selling binge on's advantages.

 

Sprint cannot be success at $1 a GB or anything ridiculously cheap like that. Not without realignment of the industry

[Deval]

Does your definition or "more innovative" mean cheaper or more gimmicks/freebies at higher prices? With unlimited available for as little as $37.50 a line on a family plan, its hard to appreciate how we can discuss health of the company and any reduction in pricing. I actually admire tmo's ability to raise pricing and reduce bucket sizes by successfully selling binge on's advantages.

 

Sprint cannot be success at $1 a GB or anything ridiculously cheap like that. Not without realignment of the industry

 

You hit the nail on the head.

 

T-Mobile's newfound success in my opinion has much to do with Binge-On and Music Freedom, both which allow subs to jump on at a fixed pricepoint without resorting to the $95 rate for totally unlimited.

 

At that point the 480p streaming limitation doesn't really matter, and not to the bulk of the new subscriber base.

[tyroned3222]

What does this mean for t mobile going foward? I know it brings more competiton to the big 2, but only having 20% market share still isnt much. Will this mean that tmobile will just become its own good company? Or can they really bring the pain to the big 2 lets say in the next 5 years. At&t is expanding into Mexico and bringing back unlimited so i dont think theu are worried one bit.. verizon is still growing even tho t mobile is taking there customers.. any thoughts opinions

 

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[orangeblue]

T-Mobile is a lot of hype because the network is by a long shot not at paar with Verizon. I have Verizon for 20 years and there is not a lot in this country where you get no LTE. With TMobile, I still see Edge plenty of times when driving across California.

[Arysyn]

Does your definition or "more innovative" mean cheaper or more gimmicks/freebies at higher prices? With unlimited available for as little as $37.50 a line on a family plan, its hard to appreciate how we can discuss health of the company and any reduction in pricing. I actually admire tmo's ability to raise pricing and reduce bucket sizes by successfully selling binge on's advantages.

 

Sprint cannot be success at $1 a GB or anything ridiculously cheap like that. Not without realignment of the industry

 

At one point, T-Mobile did in a way have pricing at $1 per gb, although it was hidden within a promotion as in getting an additional 10gb for $10, after the promotional fees which I think at the time was 10gb per line each line with two lines at $100 monthly. That I admit was a pretty innovative promotion, which also to give credit to T-Mobile, they've had plenty of great promotions.

 

I'd like to see Sprint have neat promotions on individual plans that are less complex than the 50% which a lot of customers have had difficulties with setting up after switching. Perhaps something more simple as $15 monthly per line with unlimited talk & text, then $3 per gb in data packages. At least something which is great for individual lines.