T-Mobile LTE & Network Discussion

[maximus1987/lou99]

Why don't ATT and Tmobile do a network sharing deal like the European carriers? Obviousl ATT would limit it to where TMO currently has WCDMA coverage but for a low cost carrier like TMO, it'd still be worth it.

[ericdabbs]

Why don't ATT and Tmobile do a network sharing deal like the European carriers? Obviousl ATT would limit it to where TMO currently has WCDMA coverage but for a low cost carrier like TMO, it'd still be worth it.

 

Why would ATT and Tmobile want to share their spectrum resources with each other?  ATT has only deployed LTE on 700 MHz and in large metros like Chicago where it only has 5x5 MHz block, it doesn't even have enough capacity to serve its own customers.  LTE is too bandwidth demanding and it doesn't make sense for either carrier since both carriers don't want the other carrier's customers to weigh down the network. 

 

Tmobile is fine.  They just need to catch up to the LTE game by filling in more gaps because they certainly have the momentum with their quick LTE overlay, Uncarrier plans and fresh spectrum from Verizon AWS swap, ATT AWS spectrum from breakup deal, US Cellular AWS spectrum purchase, and MetroPCS AWS/PCS spectrum from merger.  Tmobile doesn't need to make any deals right now and just focus on refarming HSPA+ to PCS and deploying LTE on AWS.

[ericdabbs]

When did they say that? I wasn't talking about greater coverage just upgrading their 15k rural 2g only towers. WCDMA voice has greater range than gsm so they wouldn't be losing any coverage. You do realize that 600 MHz won't be available for 3 years, right? You think TMO is gonna go 3 more years with 2g-only rurals? If it does that, Sprint's TDD LTE in urbania will destroy TMO.

 

Yes I truly do believe that Tmobile will wait for 600 MHz to expand their native coverage even if it is several years from now.  What rush is there?  They have a roaming agreement for voice (not sure about data) with AT&T as part of the terms for the breakup fee of the ATT/Tmobile merger.  Tmobile knows who their target consumers are and is working on a strategy to try to capture that market. Tmobile is focused on deploying LTE on AWS and refarming HSPA+ to PCS as quickly as possible to expand their footprint as well as upgrading the equipment.  They have their hands full for the next 2-3 years anyways.

 

Tomorrow is the Tmobile Q2 earnings report and we will see if this Uncarrier strategy that Tmobile has decided to go with has helped with postpaid adds in Q2.  Tmobile is in a marathon and not in a race.  They are not going to suddenly grab 20-30 million customers from other carriers over night.

 

I mean who knows maybe Tmobile will begin upgrading some rural towers to LTE and HSPA+ if Deutsch Telekom wants to be like Softbank and plow in a bunch of capital to Tmobile USA but that won't help with expanding coverage though.  If you are talking about truly expanding coverage Tmobile is not going to go all out and lease new towers just to deploy AWS or PCS spectrum until it has 600 MHz spectrum.

 

Oh and for your source, I am going to quote the famous Maximus1987 for reference.

http://s4gru.com/index.php?/topic/3420-t-mobile-lte-network-discussion/?p=140718

 

Also this Fiercewireless article pretty much sums it up

http://www.fiercewireless.com/story/t-mobile-expand-metropcs-footprint-100m-pops/2013-05-15

 

"Ray said that the company is not currently looking to expand its network footprint and is eagerly awaiting next year's scheduled incentive auctions of 600 MHz broadcast TV spectrum. He said using such spectrum is "a far more effective way to go and build those opportunities out" and that getting access to such low-band spectrum would mean "we would finally have a level playing field in the U.S. marketplace" between smaller carriers and AT&T and Verizon Wireless (NYSE:VZ), which dominated the 700 MHz auction in 2008."

[milan03]

It doesn't really matter who's gonna destroy who, and who will be in a better position in three years, to most customers it matters what their experience is like today. That's it.

If user experience starts degrading in three years, they'll start leaving T-Mobile, and look for a carrier that suits them better. But unless you're a prophet and know what'll happen, I suggests not to worry too much. Just enjoy.

[Paynefanbro]

T-Mo's results look good. Lets just see if they can keep it up with a new Sprint in the works next year.

[JeffDTD]

Yes, more than 1mil organic customer adds, if accurate, is fantastic growth, especially from a % perspective. I dont think the "no service contract" thing is an option for sprint, but the growth its caused certainly charges sprint to be a little more creative with plan offerings

 

Sent from my Note II. Its so big.

 

 

[WiWavelength]

Because a capitalist, materialist society encourages consumers to define themselves by the brands they purchase and surround themselves with, instead of individual achievements, goals, or ideals. If all your personal energy goes in to buying things, you are those things.

 

To that end, I hear that VZW is considering changing its name to LVZWMH.

 

 

 

AJ

[WiWavelength]

Oh, and I thought of some more merger candidates for T-Mobile.  Rent-A-Center, Check into Cash, and TitleMax.  Rent your new phone using a payday loan as a down payment, then get a title loan on the value of the new phone with the phone itself used as collateral.  With the clientele that T-Mobile strategy now seems to be courting, that would fit to a "T."

 

 

AJ

[S4GRU]

Oh, and I thought of some more merger candidates for T-Mobile. Rent-A-Center, Check into Cash, and TitleMax. Rent your new phone using a payday loan as a down payment, then get a title loan on the value of the new phone with the phone itself used as collateral. With the clientele that T-Mobile strategy now seems to be courting, that would fit to a "T."

 

 

AJ

Ouch.

 

Robert from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk 4 Beta

 

 

[Moropo]

If this site was about AT&T or Verizon I would understand the jest... But Sprint? *rolls eyes*

 

Sent from my SPH-L900 using Tapatalk 4

 

 

[Rawvega]

It always makes me wonder why folks that apparently have such a low opinion of Sprint bother hanging around a site that focuses on...Sprint. 

[cletus]

It always makes me wonder why folks that apparently have such a low opinion of Sprint bother hanging around a site that focuses on...Sprint. 

As this 67 page thread illustrates, we focus on more than Sprint. This is a pretty informative thread with extremely knowledgeable posters and because there is no real equivalent to S4GRU for T-Mobile users it makes sense that T-Mobile users may find their way here.

[Rawvega]

I never specifically said anything about t-mobile users, so I'm not really sure what you're trying to get at there.

 

Secondly, sure, there are general discussions about wireless spectrum and networks, but in particular Sprint & Network Vision. I suppose that only makes a bit of sense given what the "S" in S4GRU stands for. 

[WiWavelength]

If this site was about AT&T or Verizon I would understand the jest... But Sprint? *rolls eyes*

 

If John Legere wants to make an ass of himself and crack jokes about Sprint, then most everyone to ought understand the reasons behind my jest.  Equal opportunity.

 

AJ

[JohnHovah]

Oh, and I thought of some more merger candidates for T-Mobile.  Rent-A-Center, Check into Cash, and TitleMax.  Rent your new phone using a payday loan as a down payment, then get a title loan on the value of the new phone with the phone itself used as collateral.  With the clientele that T-Mobile strategy now seems to be courting, that would fit to a "T."

 

 

AJ

ROFLMFAO!!!! Ask them if they want to lease/buy a bridge while you're at it.

[cletus]

I never specifically said anything about t-mobile users, so I'm not really sure what you're trying to get at there.

 

Secondly, sure, there are general discussions about wireless spectrum and networks, but in particular Sprint & Network Vision. I suppose that only makes a bit of sense given what the "S" in S4GRU stands for. 

Right but it makes sense to me that T-mobile users might come to this thread because it has tons of information but also don't really care for Sprint users, myself included, pointing out network flaw etc.

[irev210]

If John Legere wants to make an ass of himself and crack jokes about Sprint, then most everyone to ought understand the reasons behind my jest.  Equal opportunity.

 

AJ

 

If Legere wasn't delivering, I could see your point.

 

But you are trying to poke a company that has recently done very well - certainly outperforming sprint (technical reasons aside).

 

Save the ammunition for next year.  It's going to be a different ballgame.

[maximus1987/lou99]

Yes I truly do believe that Tmobile will wait for 600 MHz to expand their native coverage even if it is several years from now. What rush is there? They have a roaming agreement for voice (not sure about data) with AT&T as part of the terms for the breakup fee of the ATT/Tmobile merger. Tmobile knows who their target consumers are and is working on a strategy to try to capture that market. Tmobile is focused on deploying LTE on AWS and refarming HSPA+ to PCS as quickly as possible to expand their footprint as well as upgrading the equipment. They have their hands full for the next 2-3 years anyways.

 

Tomorrow is the Tmobile Q2 earnings report and we will see if this Uncarrier strategy that Tmobile has decided to go with has helped with postpaid adds in Q2. Tmobile is in a marathon and not in a race. They are not going to suddenly grab 20-30 million customers from other carriers over night.

 

I mean who knows maybe Tmobile will begin upgrading some rural towers to LTE and HSPA+ if Deutsch Telekom wants to be like Softbank and plow in a bunch of capital to Tmobile USA but that won't help with expanding coverage though. If you are talking about truly expanding coverage Tmobile is not going to go all out and lease new towers just to deploy AWS or PCS spectrum until it has 600 MHz spectrum.

 

Oh and for your source, I am going to quote the famous Maximus1987 for reference.

http://s4gru.com/index.php?/topic/3420-t-mobile-lte-network-discussion/?p=140718

 

Also this Fiercewireless article pretty much sums it up

http://www.fiercewireless.com/story/t-mobile-expand-metropcs-footprint-100m-pops/2013-05-15

 

"Ray said that the company is not currently looking to expand its network footprint and is eagerly awaiting next year's scheduled incentive auctions of 600 MHz broadcast TV spectrum. He said using such spectrum is "a far more effective way to go and build those opportunities out" and that getting access to such low-band spectrum would mean "we would finally have a level playing field in the U.S. marketplace" between smaller carriers and AT&T and Verizon Wireless (NYSE:VZ), which dominated the 700 MHz auction in 2008."

When I posted that, I thought they meant:

"We're not going to going to expand to more than 52k LTE towers"

 

But it turns out what they meant was:

"We're not going to expand our LTE footprint past 37k towers without 600 MHz"

 

http://edge.media-server.com/version/1375971396/m/a/6obxvmjt/iv/f9b984f7964c7c6e2369000091bb800e41913954/?token=da8811ac0a6777c6b1694268b7f1bf352167144

Slide 10

 

2014 - 225 million LTE.

 

They don't say "end of" or "mid" 2014.

Just 2014.

 

Booooo.

 

How do they plan on surviving the onslaught from sprint and ATT prepaid brands?

Edited August 9, 2013 by maximus1902

[maximus1987/lou99]

Same link as above: interesting that TMO gained customers overall from ATT AND sprint.

Slide 6

Edited August 9, 2013 by maximus1902

[cletus]

When I posted that, I thought they meant:

"We're not going to going to expand to more than 52k LTE towers"

 

But it turns out what they meant was:

"We're not going to expand our LTE footprint past 37k towers without 600 MHz"

 

http://edge.media-server.com/version/1375971396/m/a/6obxvmjt/iv/f9b984f7964c7c6e2369000091bb800e41913954/?token=da8811ac0a6777c6b1694268b7f1bf352167144

Slide 10

 

2014 - 225 million LTE.

 

They don't say "end of" or "mid" 2014.

Just 2014.

 

Booooo.

 

How do they plan on surviving the onslaught from sprint and ATT prepaid brands?

I agree but on the other hand population trends in the US are on T-Mobile's side. Every year more and more people move to cities and rural (ie not major highways) coverage becomes less important to fewer people. Roughly 81% of people in the US live in what is classed as an Urban area. http://www.census.gov/newsroom/releases/archives/2010_census/cb12-50.html

 

However, T-Mobile's issue is that it has not kept up with the size of cities that have expanded in both population and SIZE such as Austin, San Antonio, Las Vegas. Austin city center is great on T-Mobile but heading beyond the "city limits" from 15 years ago and you will find tons of dead/roaming only areas. 

[maximus1987/lou99]

I agree but on the other hand population trends in the US are on T-Mobile's side. Every year more and more people move to cities and rural (ie not major highways) coverage becomes less important to fewer people. Roughly 81% of people in the US live in what is classed as an Urban area. http://www.census.gov/newsroom/releases/archives/2010_census/cb12-50.html

 

However, T-Mobile's issue is that it has not kept up with the size of cities that have expanded in both population and SIZE such as Austin, San Antonio, Las Vegas. Austin city center is great on T-Mobile but heading beyond the "city limits" from 15 years ago and you will find tons of dead/roaming only areas.

Did not know about lack of urban upkeep. Thanks. Digiblur said the same thing about Baton Rouge and sprint.

 

However, the point is: the high-income potential subs choose a carrier based on the LTE map. Tmobile is finally trying to obfuscate its coverage by reverting to shades of pink in its cov map.

 

Also, 0.81*310 = 251, not 225. If TMO reaches 250 with AWS LTE, I'll be satisfied.

We know that's the number - at least - that sprint is aiming at. Maybe with SoftBank they'll increase that PCS-LTE number.

Edited August 9, 2013 by maximus1902

[JeffDTD]

Legere's jabs at Sprint are indicative of his style:  Bolshy and Brash. Car Salesman. Rent to Own Furniture manager.    I applaud Tmo for finding a marketing strategy that resonated with 1+ million Americans.  However, tmo's growth doesn't mean a network strategy isn't flawed, nor does it mean Sprint network is "just a big turd".  The kindergarten mentality of those words is the tone of the message Legere exudes about his company.  I would challenge him the same way I challenge the undergraduate organization I advise: Stop talking trash about your competitors when you recruit and just focus on your competitive advantage.  

 

Right but it makes sense to me that T-mobile users might come to this thread because it has tons of information but also don't really care for Sprint users, myself included, pointing out network flaw etc.

 

For T-mo users who pry deep enough into S4GRU to find this thread, resent the obvious Sprint slant inherent in THE NAME of the site, yet continue to come here for "information" .... 

 

These would be less "intimidating" places to get informed

http://www.tmonews.com/

http://www.howardforums.com/forumdisplay.php/52-T-Mobile

http://support.t-mobile.com/community/community

[Moropo]

How many times did you consult the online thesaurus to make your post?

 

Sent from my SPH-L900 using Tapatalk 4

 

 

[JeffDTD]

How many times did you consult the online thesaurus to make your post?

 

Sent from my SPH-L900 using Tapatalk 4

 

0. However, using my "big words" as a punchline in the tmo thread is priceless.

 

Sent from my Note II. Its so big.

 

 

[koiulpoi]

How many times did you consult the online thesaurus to make your post?

 

Sent from my SPH-L900 using Tapatalk 4

Ermm... what part of that post involved "big words", of even past High School level? "exude"? "competitive advantage"? maybe? Unless your post was directed at some else, it honestly seems kinda silly, doesn't it? Talking trash instead of breaking down his argument, in an argument about the efficacy (there's one for you ) of not talking trash.