Network Vision/LTE - West Michigan Market (Grand Rapids/Lansing/Kalamazoo)

[RCM]

Finding that B41 in itself is finicky or the LG G2 is finicky holding onto it. Or both. That said, very briefly had B41 from the tower down by Menards and WILX studios on my way home today. As i grabbed my phone to snap a screenshot, it dropped back to B25. I confirmed B41 from the tower by the State Secondary Complex today as the source of that connection while I'm out by GM LDT.

 

I'm also trying to walk the fine line of giving info to general S4GRU members without divulging sponsor level info. 

[jefbal99]

That tower by the secondary complex was an early LTE tower too

 

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[MattVeltkamp]

Getting the note 4 as soon as available, coming from the note 2. Can't wait to venture out and find new lte in the grand Rapids area. Anyone know if any spark bands are out by the airport? That's where I work and as of right now reception is poor at best.

[jefbal99]

Got my first real taste of B26 LTE in downtown Grand Rapids today. Amazing having solid LTE service inside these old buildings that usually are 1x or roaming.

 

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[maxsilver]

Getting the note 4 as soon as available, coming from the note 2. Can't wait to venture out and find new lte in the grand Rapids area. Anyone know if any spark bands are out by the airport? That's where I work and as of right now reception is poor at best.

 

Nearly every tower is now running Band 25 + Band 26 LTE out there.

 

But there aren't very many cell sites, and the service from them is really weak (or "un-optimized").

[jefbal99]

Think I tasted B41 on Southside of Lansing near Menards. I'm on CM, so no engineering screens and signal check doesn't get good data. I was cycling airplane mode and looking for GCI changes, then running a speed test. In an ocean of sub 1mbps an outlier at 22mbps really stood out.

 

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[RCM]

Think I tasted B41 on Southside of Lansing near Menards. I'm on CM, so no engineering screens and signal check doesn't get good data. I was cycling airplane mode and looking for GCI changes, then running a speed test. In an ocean of sub 1mbps an outlier at 22mbps really stood out.

 

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I only briefly see B41 on this site from only the west-facing sector as I'm heading toward it in the afternoon. As soon as i handoff to the sector facing NE I immediately get dropped to B25. I don't see B41 from this site at all in the morning. This is why i was having a hard time grabbing a screen shot of engineering screens. 

[RCM]

Band 25 from the site near Lansing Menards

 

Band 41 from same site

 

[jefbal99]

I was heading west and it after passing the site that I got connected

 

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[MattVeltkamp]

Guys is there an article anywhere that I can read that can get me up to speed with spark? Don't understand all the bands and frequencies. I haven't found anything explaining it. Any help would be great.

[exadyne]

Guys is there an article anywhere that I can read that can get me up to speed with spark? Don't understand all the bands and frequencies. I haven't found anything explaining it. Any help would be great.

Spark is just Sprint's marketing name for Tri-Band devices. Sprint uses Band 26 (800mhz), Band 25 (1900mhz extended g block), and Band 41 (2600mhz - the frequency WiMax runs on).

This discusses the marketing,

http://s4gru.com/index.php?/topic/4950-sprint-spark-official-name-for-the-tri-band-network-was-sprint-to-demo-its-25ghz-network-technology/

But I'd imagine you're wondering more about the actual semi-technical details?

[njjdnt]

Guys is there an article anywhere that I can read that can get me up to speed with spark? Don't understand all the bands and frequencies. I haven't found anything explaining it. Any help would be great.

http://s4gru.com/index.php?/topic/1704-frequently-asked-questions/

[jefbal99]

SCP alerted me B41 LTE around Westphalia on Grange Rd and Price Rd heading into and out of town.

 

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[jefbal99]

Wish I had spare cash

 

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[danny1st]

Wish I had spare cash

 

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I hear ya, really want to know the status on the north side of Wyoming area before I commit to an upgrade to a tri-band (S3 as of the moment). Switched jobs and took a huge pay cut for more time with the family. Worth it of course, but was no were near the premium member minimum. And with all the towers upgraded to 1900 LTE had no reason to remain just a lowly old member

[Theot]

I hear ya, really want to know the status on the north side of Wyoming area before I commit to an upgrade to a tri-band (S3 as of the moment). Switched jobs and took a huge pay cut for more time with the family. Worth it of course, but was no were near the premium member minimum. And with all the towers upgraded to 1900 LTE had no reason to remain just a lowly old member

That's where I'm at, I'd love a new G3 or note 4 to test out here in GR. But to keep my bill near where it currently is I'd have to sign another contract which at this point I'm not willing to do. Even with the network upgrades in GR, will it really matter much for overall speeds and coverage with the towers being so far apart anyway? And wimax isn't getting shut off till next year so who knows when the 3rd band will be going.

 

Still on my note 2, but only have usable LTE in maybe 3 spots around GR where I need it and it's not super reliable. And I don't count sprints 3G as usable for much. My contract is up December 28, right now I think I'm going to AT&T prepaid with a moto G unless things change drastically with sprint very soon which I doubt.

Edited October 19, 2014 by Theot

[maxsilver]

will it really matter much for overall speeds and coverage with the towers being so far apart anyway?

 

Speeds will get better, but likely only within a close radius of the existing towers.

 

Grand Rapids is almost entirely mapped on Sensorly, the areas on the map that show Sprint LTE as "4 bars" or "3 bars" of purple -- those are roughly the areas I suspect will get usable Band 41 "Spark" speed.

 

I suspect the rest of the city will be using the network as it exists today -- Band 25 + Band 26.

 

Some folks will say "moving traffic to Band 41 speeds up Band 25/26". This is *technically* true, but in Grand Rapids specifically, that's not really helpful at this moment, for a whole bunch of reasons (limited coverage of Band 41 + poorly-chosen site locations + and poor density).

 

I could post a detailed write up of it using some specific examples (such as Downtown GR / the Transit Center / Woodland + Eastbrook Mall, Rivertown Mall) but I'm a little scared to do so here, it might not be appreciated in this venue.

 

 - - -

 

But for what it's worth, some work is being done in this market, and for those areas, it is helping.

 

For instance, the site by 29th and Breton now has real backhaul. Today, I pulled down 30mbps off of B25. It's the only Sprint site in West Michigan I've *ever* seen faster than 12mbps, on any band. And that site is not unloaded -- it's Sunday afternoon, and that site is intended to cover all of Woodland Mall.

 

That's double the speed of AT&T's 10x10 B17 in that same location

[maxsilver]

 

I think I'm going to AT&T prepaid with a moto G

 

Your free to do that, and it may solve some of your problems. (site density is somewhat better, site placement is *much* better).

 

But AT&T is slowing down a bit here too. We're a B17-only market, and AT&T has halted a lot of upgrade work, so while AT&T has more capacity than Sprint here, it's not tons more by any means.

 

I *really* hate to say this, but Verizon is easily the best option here at the moment. You get triple the speeds of everyone else, along with the more+better coverage. Verizon's really doing some crazy good engineering work in Grand Rapids.

 

For example, they built a brand new tower in Grandville, just a half a mile away from the old site (next to Steak and Shake, that Sprint / AT&T / Metro CDMA all run on), just so that AWS would propagate properly up to the new suburbs south of the hill behind Rivertown Mall.

 

That's crazy attention to detail, that I was certain no carrier had noticed or would ever notice. But Verizon finally did, and did something about it. I don't particularly like the company in any way, but I'm impressed by that attention to detail.

[Shima]

Your free to do that, and it may solve some of your problems. (site density is somewhat better, site placement is *much* better).

 

But AT&T is slowing down a bit here too. We're a B17-only market, and AT&T has halted a lot of upgrade work, so while AT&T has more capacity than Sprint here, it's not tons more by any means.

 

I *really* hate to say this, but Verizon is easily the best option here at the moment. You get triple the speeds of everyone else, along with the more+better coverage. Verizon's really doing some crazy good engineering work in Grand Rapids.

 

For example, they built a brand new tower in Grandville, just a half a mile away from the old site (next to Steak and Shake, that Sprint / AT&T / Metro CDMA all run on), just so that AWS would propagate properly up to the new suburbs south of the hill behind Rivertown Mall.

 

That's crazy attention to detail, that I was certain no carrier had noticed or would ever notice. But Verizon finally did, and did something about it. I don't particularly like the company in any way, but I'm impressed by that attention to detail.

In the last few weeks I've also experienced B26 25+ mb down and 10+ up when connected to the tower off 84th in Byron Center. Several other locations around GR I am seeing more B26 connectivity lately. Things seem to be getting better for Sprint. Bring on some B41!

[maxsilver]

In the last few weeks I've also experienced B26 25+ mb down and 10+ up when connected to the tower off 84th in Byron Center. Several other locations around GR I am seeing more B26 connectivity lately. Things seem to be getting better for Sprint. Bring on some B41!

 

Normally, I would have said, "that's crazy!", but I experienced it firsthand today.

 

I know this probably isn't true, but it sure feels like Sprint lit LTE on these sites before backhaul was installed (market-ish wide), and that now that backhaul is finally installed on a few of these sites, we're slowly getting the LTE speeds that other markets have.

 

That's the only explanation I can think of. Because Band 26 has been live for months, and Band 25 at the mall did not get any less-used between last week and this week, but speeds are easily 5 times faster now than they were before.

[S4GRU]

Normally, I would have said, "that's crazy!", but I experienced it firsthand today.

 

I know this probably isn't true, but it sure feels like Sprint lit LTE on these sites before backhaul was installed (market-ish wide), and that now that backhaul is finally installed on a few of these sites, we're slowly getting the LTE speeds that other markets have.

 

That's the only explanation I can think of. Because Band 26 has been live for months, and Band 25 at the mall did not get any less-used between last week and this week, but speeds are easily 5 times faster now than they were before.

 

It's possible.  Early markets had lots of AAV, and later markets were almost exclusively fiber.  It is possible that you are seeing fiber coming to these early AAV sites and it could have noticeable throughput performance improvements.

[Theot]

For instance, the site by 29th and Breton now has real backhaul. Today, I pulled down 30mbps off of B25. It's the only Sprint site in West Michigan I've *ever* seen faster than 12mbps, on any band. And that site is not unloaded -- it's Sunday afternoon, and that site is intended to cover all of Woodland Mall.

 

That's double the speed of AT&T's 10x10 B17 in that same location

I appreciate the info. For what it's worth anytime I've been at woodland or Centerpoint in the past few months I couldn't even pull up a map on LTE or 3G. Again I'm on a note 2 so that may be why. I guess what irritates me most is that when I don't have LTE the 3G is sooooo slow. At least with AT&T hspa is significantly better.

 

I may need to go get a tri band phone to try out for a couple weeks and see if it makes enough of a difference to stay.

 

 

 

Your free to do that, and it may solve some of your problems. (site density is somewhat better, site placement is *much* better).

 

But AT&T is slowing down a bit here too. We're a B17-only market, and AT&T has halted a lot of upgrade work, so while AT&T has more capacity than Sprint here, it's not tons more by any means.

 

I *really* hate to say this, but Verizon is easily the best option here at the moment. You get triple the speeds of everyone else, along with the more+better coverage. Verizon's really doing some crazy good engineering work in Grand Rapids.

 

For example, they built a brand new tower in Grandville, just a half a mile away from the old site (next to Steak and Shake, that Sprint / AT&T / Metro CDMA all run on), just so that AWS would propagate properly up to the new suburbs south of the hill behind Rivertown Mall.

 

That's crazy attention to detail, that I was certain no carrier had noticed or would ever notice. But Verizon finally did, and did something about it. I don't particularly like the company in any way, but I'm impressed by that attention to detail.

I had verizon for 2 years before the current 22 months on sprint and while I know their coverage is better and the speeds were good, I can't justify the cost of their service. Edited October 20, 2014 by Theot

[maxsilver]

I appreciate the info. For what it's worth anytime I've been at woodland or Centerpoint in the past few months I couldn't even pull up a map on LTE or 3G. Again I'm on a note 2 so that may be why. I guess what irritates me most is that when I don't have LTE the 3G is sooooo slow. At least with AT&T hspa is significantly better.

 

That's fair -- and normally I would have agreed with this. I have a brand new triband device, and have experienced the same thing on all bands for months and months.

 

It's literally only since yesterday, that LTE appeared to be working for me at Woodland (I pulled down 30mbps at the "Woodland Tower", over by 29th and Breton. I pulled 4mbps down outside Woodland Mall proper).

 

And for what it's worth, I got those speeds on B25. So even with your Note 2, you should be able to see some of that speed improvement, if you head over there now.

 

Inside the mall is probably still a deadzone, but the parking lot should at least be usable now.

[Theot]

 

 

That's fair -- and normally I would have agreed with this. I have a brand new triband device, and have experienced the same thing on all bands for months and months.

 

It's literally only since yesterday, that LTE appeared to be working for me at Woodland (I pulled down 30mbps at the "Woodland Tower", over by 29th and Breton. I pulled 4mbps down outside Woodland Mall proper).

 

And for what it's worth, I got those speeds on B25. So even with your Note 2, you should be able to see some of that speed improvement, if you head over there now.

 

Inside the mall is probably still a deadzone, but the parking lot should at least be usable now.

Good to know. And just for the record those issues I was having at the malls were in the parking lot so I'll have to check it out.

[RCM]

I saw crews working on two towers installing B41 equipment along I-96 between Howell and Okemos on Sept 29 and 30. One of those towers had B41 live as I drove by this morning.