Will any of the new phones coming out support 800mhz SMR data?

[GoWireless]

Basing on how the 4S should have been more than capable of 800CDMA, Apple should have done it, but instead they based it on Sprint's current network, not on the future.

...

 

It's possible that there wasn't enough time for Apple to prep for 800CDMA when the 4S came out. It would have required more significant changes to the radio and antenna in the device than would be required in the 5S. In the 5, the antenna and radio is already there covering ESMR and CLR, which are two contiguous bands. Hence extending LTE into the other band should be a simpler undertaking than putting CDMA800 in the 4S, which didn't include the 800 band at all in the previous model.

 

You can make that assumption with just about any phone. But if you look at the past with Apple, they always follow one footstep behind the others in hardware. They've done it with everyone phone including the very original iphone, so I do not expect them to alter their practices. (This is not a bash on them so please do not start an Apple/Android/WP throw down)

 

On the other hand, Apple also included LTE support in the CLR and PCS bands (A-F), even though no carrier has deployed LTE in those bands. Therefore, I do not think it would be all that surprising for them to "stretch" their existing CLR band LTE coverage into Sprint's CDMA 800 band which abuts it.

Edited February 18, 2013 by GoWireless

[WiWavelength]

The issue is much less what Apple *can* do, far more what Apple will actually *choose* to do.

 

AJ

[MacinJosh]

You can make that assumption with just about any phone. But if you look at the past with Apple, they always follow one footstep behind the others in hardware. They've done it with everyone phone including the very original iphone, so I do not expect them to alter their practices. (This is not a bash on them so please do not start an Apple/Android/WP throw down)

 

All manufacturers have their quirks. I could say that the EVO Shift should have had the same processor as the EVO 4G, but HTC had their reasons. The overall problem is, communication between the carriers and device manufacturers is not as good as it should be.

 

It's possible that there wasn't enough time for Apple to prep for 800CDMA when the 4S came out. It would have required more significant changes to the radio and antenna in the device than would be required in the 5S. In the 5, the antenna and radio is already there covering ESMR and CLR, which are two contiguous bands. Hence extending LTE into the other band should be a simpler undertaking than putting CDMA800 in the 4S, which didn't include the 800 band at all in the previous model.

 

 

 

On the other hand, Apple also included LTE support in the CLR and PCS bands (A-F), even though no carrier has deployed LTE in those bands. Therefore, I do not think it would be all that surprising for them to "stretch" their existing CLR band LTE coverage into Sprint's CDMA 800 band which abuts it.

 

There was time for the 4S to have 800CDMA. Most Sprint phones in 2011 were given it. The EVO 3D was announced in March, which gave Apple plenty of time to integrate it, but they chose not to as an exercise of control.

 

On the other hand, if at&t had had their way when the iPhone 1st came out, it would have had 3G from the start, but Apple was in control, and at&t had no say. In essence, they were Apple's b***h, for lack of a better term.

 

And the reason that iPhone 5 supports LTE on PCS A-F, is because Band Class 25 (PCS A-G) is a superset of Band Class 2, and therefore, you can support both LTE bands at the same time.

[GoWireless]

...

There was time for the 4S to have 800CDMA. Most Sprint phones in 2011 were given it. The EVO 3D was announced in March, which gave Apple plenty of time to integrate it, but they chose not to as an exercise of control.

...

 

I am not sure the statement "Most Sprint phones in 2011 were given it" is accurate. Remember that the the EVO 3D didn't come out until just before the second half of the year.

 

Remember too that the 4S was an incremental upgrade, not a brand new phone from scratch. As such, it is conceivable that Apple wasn't going to make a change as major as supporting a brand new band they never covered before (compared to the iPhone 5, which already supports that band).

 

...

And the reason that iPhone 5 supports LTE on PCS A-F, is because Band Class 25 (PCS A-G) is a superset of Band Class 2, and therefore, you can support both LTE bands at the same time.

 

Yes, but don't forget the CLR band's LTE inclusion which no provider supports. It should also be noted that band class 5 is a subset of band class 26.

 

In other words, what I am trying to say is that it from a technical perspective, it will be easier for Apple to add band 26 support in the incremental 5S version than it was for them to add CDMA BC10 support in the incremental 4S version. This may sway a decision in favor of including it on the 5S.

Edited February 18, 2013 by GoWireless

[MacinJosh]

I am not sure the statement "Most Sprint phones in 2011 were given it" is accurate. Remember that the the EVO 3D didn't come out until just before the second half of the year.

 

Remember too that the 4S was an incremental upgrade, not a brand new phone from scratch. As such, it is conceivable that Apple wasn't going to make a change as major as supporting a brand new band they never covered before (compared to the iPhone 5, which already supports that band).

 

 

 

Yes, but don't forget the CLR band's LTE inclusion which no provider supports. It should also be noted that band class 5 is a subset of band class 26.

 

In other words, what I am trying to say is that it from a technical perspective, it will be easier for Apple to add band 26 support in the incremental 5S version than it was for them to add CDMA BC10 support in the incremental 4S version. This may sway a decision in favor of including it on the 5S.

 

I guess we shall see when it comes out.

 

And the EVO 3D was announced in March, 3 months before release, and so the March date takes more precedence than actual release date in terms of support for Band Class 10 on Sprint devices.

[Fraydog]

I would guess that A1428, the GSM model sold for AT&T in the US along with the Canadian LTE providers Bell, Telus, Rogers, and Fido can be upgraded to support CLR and PCS LTE with a future software update.

 

That's just a guess though, I have no way of knowing.

[Paynefanbro]

The HTC One is supposed to be a world phone that works in over 80 countries. Could suport for 2600Mhz or 800Mhz be included in that device. If so I know that'll be my next phone.

[GoWireless]

The HTC One is supposed to be a world phone that works in over 80 countries. Could suport for 2600Mhz or 800Mhz be included in that device. If so I know that'll be my next phone.

 

Question is, will there be one or two models which work all over a-la the iPhone, or will there be a gazillion variants like the SGSIII.

 

To the best of my knowledge, the device hasn't passed the FCC yet so it's hard to tell what exactly we'll be getting. Launch is supposed to be late next month, but if there will be a separate Sprint variant, it could come out later than that. Interestingly, Verizon is not on the list of carriers who would be selling the phone right now.

[Josh]

 

Remember too that the 4S was an incremental upgrade, not a brand new phone from scratch. As such, it is conceivable that Apple wasn't going to make a change as major as supporting a brand new band they never covered before (compared to the iPhone 5, which already supports that band).

 

 

Don't forget one of the main reasons apple kept the 4s the same was to keep some of the components the same so that they could gain higher margins for their phones. The added features that most other refreshed phones get (processor, memory, camera, software, etc) but were able to keep manufacturing the same shell and identical assembly line. Also, they have accessories that fit both phones, making more selection and a better experience for people shopping for those products. Radios could have been changed, and probably were replaced with more efficient models, the decision to support more bands is low on their priority list. Even sprint might not want to push apple to include support, b/c when they finally launch 800Mhz LTE and clearwire spectrum, they want people to have to sign into new 2 year commitments. They might actually like people to see a night and day difference, so they can justify a price increase or capped data.

 

The HTC One is supposed to be a world phone that works in over 80 countries. Could suport for 2600Mhz or 800Mhz be included in that device. If so I know that'll be my next phone.

 

The HTC One (or should I say the "New One" lol) still will be world roaming on GSM. From what I have seen on other sites, only a verizon or sprint version will have both CDMA and GSM, but I have been misinformed before... what I would assume is that 800MHz LTE is much less likely than is 2500-2600 TDD-LTE because china and japan are using this spectrum and sprint is the only carrier using 800... and its not going to be turned on until Q4 at the earliest.

[GoWireless]

"The One" (oh Lord, what a silly name, given that they already have a One X, One V, etc.) passed the FCC today (FCCID NM8PN07200). No LTE800 on this puppy. In fact, I have a gut feeling GSM may be disabled on Sprint's variant. This wouldn't surprise anyone given that this is a company that does such inane things as using soldered-on SIMs.

Edited February 22, 2013 by GoWireless

[S4GRU]

"The One" (oh Lord, what a silly name, given that they already have a One X, One V, etc.) passed the FCC today (FCCID NM8PN07200). No LTE800 on this puppy. In fact, I have a gut feeling GSM may be disabled on Sprint's variant. This wouldn't surprise anyone given that this is a company that does such inane things as using soldered-on SIMs.

 

Sprint has been billing this as a world phone.

 

Robert via Samsung Note II via Tapatalk

 

 

[lynyrd65]

Sprint has been billing this as a world phone.

 

Robert via Samsung Note II via Tapatalk

 

Sprint has also said their aim this year (not sure if "One" is included) is to make all upper tier (highend smartphones) world phones with GSM functionality and removable sims! It also appears the removable SIMs allow movement of devices on the Sprint network (no more calling in and registering MEID)

 

Interview (relevant info late in interview) go to 13:13

[GoWireless]

Sprint has been billing this as a world phone.

 

Thanks, I really hope so. Some of the early reports indicated some strange UMTS/WCDMA bands in Sprint's device. Rich over at phonescoop initially showed GSM and UMTS capability for Sprint's device, but has since redone the page without GSM and UMTS. A bit worrying because he's usually pretty good at putting up the right specs for devices.

 

When I got my Photon, it having overseas GSM/WCDMA capability was definitely a one of the features that sold me on the device.

 

Sprint has also said their aim this year (not sure if "One" is included) is to make all upper tier (highend smartphones) world phones with GSM functionality and removable sims! It also appears the removable SIMs allow movement of devices on the Sprint network (no more calling in and registering MEID)

...

 

I heard his comments to mean that they will ensure better interoperability with GSM by stopping their annoying use of embedded SIMs and not disabling GSM features in devices, however, not necessarily to mean that they will introduce CDMA device portability using SIMs (which is a relatively common practice on Asian CDMA networks, but one which US networks have been loath to adopt).

[WiWavelength]

"The One" (oh Lord, what a silly name, given that they already have a One X, One V, etc.) passed the FCC today (FCCID NM8PN07200). No LTE800 on this puppy. In fact, I have a gut feeling GSM may be disabled on Sprint's variant. This wouldn't surprise anyone given that this is a company that does such inane things as using soldered-on SIMs.

 

I am sorry, but I have to offer a stern response to this "inane" post.

 

First, as soon as Asian companies started naming American handsets, there have been plenty of "inane" names: LG Chocolate 2, Samsung Galaxy S II Epic 4G Touch, HTC Droid Eris, etc. By comparison, HTC One is practically a paragon of straightforward sense (no pun intended) and simplicity. The "one" legitimate criticism that you can really make is that the flagship handset last year was called the HTC One X, while the flagship this year is just the HTC One. Regardless, "One" is HTC's global brand to compete with singular "iPhone" and "Galaxy" branding from Apple and Samsung, respectively.

 

Second, are embedded SIMs "inane" if Sprint has a valid reason for going that route? FYI, Sprint has had removable SIMs on the internal Network Vision roadmap since at least early last year. Removable SIMs are coming -- just not yet. Some of us speculate that problems with iDEN SIM swapping could be the reason. There could be plenty of other reasons, namely, that Sprint's CDMA2000 network is not set up to utilize SIMs. So, how about you give Sprint the benefit of the doubt that it knows what it is doing? Or do you just have all the answers?

 

AJ

[GoWireless]

 

 

I am sorry, but I have to offer a stern response to this "inane" post.

 

First, as soon as Asian companies started naming American handsets, there have been plenty of "inane" names: LG Chocolate 2, Samsung Galaxy S II Epic 4G Touch, HTC Droid Eris, etc. By comparison, HTC One is practically a paragon of straightforward sense (no pun intended) and simplicity. The "one" legitimate criticism that you can really make is that the flagship handset last year was called the HTC One X, while the flagship this year is just the HTC One. Regardless, "One" is HTC's global brand to compete with singular "iPhone" and "Galaxy" branding from Apple and Samsung, respectively.

 

...

 

Sorry, I wasn't clear enough... I don't have a problem with the moniker "One" per se. In fact, I think it's pretty clever. What I have a problem with is using it now, after they have already released other models named "One [something]" (X, X+, V). That's quite confusing. If it was the first time they had used One in the name it would be a different story. Imagine if Samsung called the Galaxy S4 just "the Galaxy".

 

In any case, I wish HTC all the best in their competition against The Samsung-Apple doupoly.

Edited February 23, 2013 by GoWireless

[GoWireless]

...

Second, are embedded SIMs "inane" if Sprint has a valid reason for going that route? FYI, Sprint has had removable SIMs on the internal Network Vision roadmap since at least early last year. Removable SIMs are coming -- just not yet. Some of us speculate that problems with iDEN SIM swapping could be the reason. There could be plenty of other reasons, namely, that Sprint's CDMA2000 network is not set up to utilize SIMs. So, how about you give Sprint the benefit of the doubt that it knows what it is doing? Or do you just have all the answers?

 

AJ

 

Well, Big Red has been using removable SIMs all this time. How? Simple, the use SIMs for the LTE side of the network only. I suspect that's exactly what Sprint is going to do. If that's the case, one would think they could have been using them all this time.

[WiWavelength]

Well, Big Red has been using removable SIMs all this time. How? Simple, the use SIMs for the LTE side of the network only. I suspect that's exactly what Sprint is going to do. If that's the case, one would think they could have been using them all this time.

 

VZW has also had major issues with its LTE and eHRPD/EV-DO networks not getting along and suffering major outages. So, I would not hold up VZW as a shining example of how to integrate LTE and CDMA2000. It is not as simple as you make it out to be.

 

Regardless, as I stated previously, removable SIMs are upcoming on the internal Network Vision roadmap, but they were not implemented right away for a reason. Give Sprint the benefit of the doubt.

 

AJ

[Fraydog]

While I think many people are frustrated that Sprint has embedded SIM's, I can understand why at this point they went this route. Sprint can't afford major outages at this point, like what Verizon sustained, in building out their 4G LTE network through Network Vision.

[peteyz24]

Forgive me for my ignorance but what the heck is the big deal with not having a removable SIM?

[MacinJosh]

Forgive me for my ignorance but what the heck is the big deal with not having a removable SIM?

 

Having a removable SIM means being able to use another Carrier's SIM card in your phone while you visit another country instead of having to rack up international calling up the you know what. There is a side benefit for GSM users that they can hot swap devices, but there are some limitations with CDMA devices and hot-swapping LTE SIM's that will hopefully be worked out by the time Sprint stops using embedded SIM's.

[peteyz24]

Having a removable SIM means being able to use another Carrier's SIM card in your phone while you visit another country instead of having to rack up international calling up the you know what. There is a side benefit for GSM users that they can hot swap devices, but there are some limitations with CDMA devices and hot-swapping LTE SIM's that will hopefully be worked out by the time Sprint stops using embedded SIM's.

 

I see, thank you for the explanation. Being able to hot swap phones would be kinda nice.

[jamesinclair]

VZW has also had major issues with its LTE and eHRPD/EV-DO networks not getting along and suffering major outages. So, I would not hold up VZW as a shining example of how to integrate LTE and CDMA2000. It is not as simple as you make it out to be.

 

Regardless, as I stated previously, removable SIMs are upcoming on the internal Network Vision roadmap, but they were not implemented right away for a reason. Give Sprint the benefit of the doubt.

 

AJ

 

If swapping sims is such an issue (and I really doubt it would be) why didn't Sprint offer devices with two sims? One hardwired in, one only useful for international travel?

 

Ive been meaning to start a thread about Sprints international plan. From what I can tell, they have the worst international options of the major us carriers, and it baffles me as to why. From what I understand, going forward all Verizon phones will be "world" phones, and thats a strategy I think sprint should have adopted years ago.

[GoWireless]

 

If swapping sims is such an issue (and I really doubt it would be) why didn't Sprint offer devices with two sims? One hardwired in, one only useful for international travel?

 

Ive been meaning to start a thread about Sprints international plan. From what I can tell, they have the worst international options of the major us carriers, and it baffles me as to why. From what I understand, going forward all Verizon phones will be "world" phones, and thats a strategy I think sprint should have adopted years ago.

 

International support is a secondary consideration for Sprint, certainly not nearly enough to merit such an unusual SIM arrangement (at least for an American carrier, and particularly a CDMA one).

 

Sprint used to have a great international data plan (especially for CDMA roaming) years ago but it was discontinued about 3 years ago IIRC. I would turn it on before I went overseas (it required temporarily switching plans to it). The only way they would let you keep it is if you kept it active on your account, which while in the US didn't make sense. In any case, with great prepaid SIM options available in just about every country nowadays, it's not such a big deal anymore.

 

As for Verizon, I think Vodafone is who kept pushing them to offer GSM capable sets over the years, which is a good thing. These days with most CDMA handset radios handling GSM too, adding GSM to a CDMA device isn't that difficult an undertaking. One thing I have to commend Sprint on is that on most of their GSM-capable devices (as limited a selection as that may have been) they've tended to keep the GSM SIM unlocked for usage outside North America. I do believe the iPhone though is shipped locked unfortunately.

Edited February 24, 2013 by GoWireless

[thensley1983]

i've been reading up on some of the new chip sets that phones may be getting and it all deppends on the release date its looking like snapdragon 600 (won't get lte adv support) but if in march they say that the s4 is getting the snapdragon 800 then then from what i was reading on the snapdragon website the chip will support all bands and it would be a "furture proof" chip set that only needs a software update to support a new band though that would also mean that we wouldn't see the gs4 till july when snapdragon plans on releasing 800 don't look for the new tegra series chip sets in the gs4 due to them not releasing them till 4th quarter this year

http://www.qualcomm.com/snapdragon/processors/800-600-400-200/specs

http://www.nvidia.com/object/tegra-4-processor.html

[WiWavelength]

Going forward, Samsung wants to use its own processors. Qualcomm Snapdragon is a longshot. And software defined radio is one of the most over hyped technologies in recent memory. It does not mean software defined antennas and power amps.

 

AJ