2.5Ghz Spectrum Clearwire Panels and Gear?

[bucdenny]

Now that Sprint owns Clearwire 100%, is Sprint planning to deploy 2.5Ghz part of their NV? Or Clear planning their own network moving forward? Wouldn't it make sense to put 2.5Ghz on all Sprint towers included with the NV? It's a lot of spectrum, 800, 850, 1900, 2500. LTE will be smoking fast!

[iansltx]

Now that Sprint owns Clearwire 100%, is Sprint planning to deploy 2.5Ghz part of their NV? Or Clear planning their own network moving forward? Wouldn't it make sense to put 2.5Ghz on all Sprint towers included with the NV? It's a lot of spectrum, 800, 850, 1900, 2500. LTE will be smoking fast!

 

I'll give it half an hour before mods close this thread as it has been talk about before, but...

 

Sprint's primary use for Clearwire's 2500/2600 spectrum is as an offload band in high-density environments. Where capacity is an issue, TD-LTE in 2600 is lit until capacity is no longer an issue. This is done on a site-by-site basis, though Softbank's ulterior motive for getting more TD-LTE 2600 out there (economies of scale back home in Japan) may bias things toward more LTE 2600 rather than less.

 

That said, you won't see TD-LTE 2600 on every tower, unless something really crazy happens, for example someone (Sprint or some MVNO of theirs, maybe even Dish) wants to do fixed wireless using BRS/EBS spectrum, you won't see TD-LTE 2600 on every NV site. In the mobile environment, there just isn't the need for that much capacity over that small of an area (at 2500/2600 on a mobile device you're playing the odds if you try to get service more than a mile from the tower).

 

Also, Sprint doesn't own 850 MHz spectrum at all. Just SMR (aka 800), PCS (usually 30MHz of A-F, plus 10MHz of G) and now BRS, plus some leases on EBS (2500/2600 MHz). With the proper network architecture, they've got a decent amount of air link capacity to do with what they wish, though PCS H or S band...or more PCS...wouldn't hurt in the long run.

[leozno1]

I'll give it half an hour before mods close this thread as it has been talk about before, but...

 

Sprint's primary use for Clearwire's 2500/2600 spectrum is as an offload band in high-density environments. Where capacity is an issue, TD-LTE in 2600 is lit until capacity is no longer an issue. This is done on a site-by-site basis, though Softbank's ulterior motive for getting more TD-LTE 2600 out there (economies of scale back home in Japan) may bias things toward more LTE 2600 rather than less.

 

That said, you won't see TD-LTE 2600 on every tower, unless something really crazy happens, for example someone (Sprint or some MVNO of theirs, maybe even Dish) wants to do fixed wireless using BRS/EBS spectrum, you won't see TD-LTE 2600 on every NV site. In the mobile environment, there just isn't the need for that much capacity over that small of an area (at 2500/2600 on a mobile device you're playing the odds if you try to get service more than a mile from the tower).

 

Also, Sprint doesn't own 850 MHz spectrum at all. Just SMR (aka 800), PCS (usually 30MHz of A-F, plus 10MHz of G) and now BRS, plus some leases on EBS (2500/2600 MHz). With the proper network architecture, they've got a decent amount of air link capacity to do with what they wish, though PCS H or S band...or more PCS...wouldn't hurt in the long run.

 

I think that was their original plan with Clearwire but I think that was only because they would still have to pay Clearwire based on usage so they only wanted to use them when necessary. But now that Sprint intends to buy them outright, Sprint no longer needs to pay Clearwire for using their spectrum and it would be Sprint's spectrum to do as they please with. Perhaps they don't do it now or next year, but I think its plausible that they can put LTE 2500 on all towers. Well in the cities at least since it doesn't really do anything to have LTE 2500 in the rural areas since those towers wont really be strained and 2500 range isn't as good as 1900 or 800.

[EvoMania]

I would love to see them deploy it on all metro area towers.

[etirkca]

 

I think that was their original plan with Clearwire but I think that was only because they would still have to pay Clearwire based on usage so they only wanted to use them when necessary. But now that Sprint intends to buy them outright, Sprint no longer needs to pay Clearwire for using their spectrum and it would be Sprint's spectrum to do as they please with. Perhaps they don't do it now or next year, but I think its plausible that they can put LTE 2500 on all towers. Well in the cities at least since it doesn't really do anything to have LTE 2500 in the rural areas since those towers wont really be strained and 2500 range isn't as good as 1900 or 800.

 

Sprint paid a flat rate for unlimited WiMax usage. The details are in a Sprint press release when they agreed to partner with Clear until 2015.

 

There's no way S will put 2500 LTE on all their towers. Overkill.

 

Sent from mobile

 

 

[TheForce627]

 

 

Sprint paid a flat rate for unlimited WiMax usage. The details are in a Sprint press release when they agreed to partner with Clear until 2015.

 

There's no way S will put 2500 LTE on all their towers. Overkill.

 

Sent from mobile

yes sprint paid a flat rate for wimax but for lte it would be usage based

[S4GRU]

It won't matter anymore after S finishes the buyout of CLWR.

 

Robert via Samsung Note II via Tapatalk

 

 

[supert0nes]

This brings up a great old topic. 2500 priority! Now Sprint will have no reservations about 2500 > 1900 > 800

[JohnnyAwesome]

This brings up a great old topic. 2500 priority! Now Sprint will have no reservations about 2500 > 1900 > 800

 

They probably knew this was coming as I forget in which piece of material but there was mention of a 3rd frequency at some point

[halcyoncmdr]

They probably knew this was coming as I forget in which piece of material but there was mention of a 3rd frequency at some point

 

Almost every bit of NV-centric training in the retail stores has talked about 2500>1900>800 from the beginning. I don't think it was ever a matter of if it was going to happen, but rather just a matter of exactly how it was going to happen.

 

I'm sure back when NV was being concocted by the Network teams they were already considering a possible buyout of Clearwire (just missing the cash for it).

 

The Clearwire purchase hinges entirely on the Softbank deal, if it is not approved, no Clearwire purchase. Simple as that. This is probably why equipment for 2500 was not included in the NV process, Sprint would not have the cash for all of it, Softbank however is a different story (More than twice the market cap of Sprint as of today).

[utiz4321]

The SoftBank deal will go through. There is no reason for it not to. The clearwire buyout might not, there is a lot of investor backlash and the FCC might require sprint to sell some spectrum as a condition for approving the deal. So there is still a lot of uncertainty, but I hope it goes through and sprint retains control of all of the clear spectrum. This would allow them to be a disruptive force in the wireless market and keep cheap unlimited plans.

[Thomas L.]

The SoftBank deal will go through. There is no reason for it not to. The clearwire buyout might not, there is a lot of investor backlash and the FCC might require sprint to sell some spectrum as a condition for approving the deal. So there is still a lot of uncertainty, but I hope it goes through and sprint retains control of all of the clear spectrum. This would allow them to be a disruptive force in the wireless market and keep cheap unlimited plans.

 

I think the end result if the FCC gives Sprint any trouble about the buyout is most likely to be them returning their leased spectrum to the educational institutions, etc, that Clearwire had leased it from so they can just retain all of what Clearwire actually owns. As for the investors, well, without Sprint, both as a customer and a funder of debt, they'd be holding stock worth pennies in all likelihood if Clearwire didn't end up bankrupt - they are certainly going to make a lot of noise, it´s expected as they want as much money as possible, but I don't know what would really come of it.

[S4GRU]

I think Sprint is fully prepared to give up EBS spectrum. It has almost no value. It is better geared for local ISP use anyway. Trying to manage 400 separate leases with varying terms and expirations has been a nightmare for Clearwire. Also, who wants to go spend a lot of money installing a network in a market using EBS spectrum on a lease that expires in one or two years and the educational institution comes back with unreasonable demands? It's a nightmare scenario. About 1/3 of Clearwire EBS leases expire in the next two years. And some EBS lessees are planning a big show down.

 

Robert via Samsung Note II via Tapatalk

 

 

[Deval]

Brings up an interesting point, I think AJ addressed it somewhere else.

 

If the EBS spectrum leases are allowed to expire, or return back to institution, where does that leave Sprint in terms of spectrum holdings in the upper bands?

[WiWavelength]

If the EBS spectrum leases are allowed to expire, or return back to institution, where does that leave Sprint in terms of spectrum holdings in the upper bands?

 

Actually, we have been discussing that in the Clearwire acquisition thread this very morning.

 

Total EBS bandwidth is 117.5 MHz, while total BRS bandwidth is 76.5 MHz. So, it would be impossible for Sprint to hold 100 MHz of BRS bandwidth. And of the 76.5 MHz total BRS bandwidth, only 55.5 MHz of that is "attributable" because it is in a contiguous block.

Beyond the 55.5 MHz "attributable" BRS2-H3 blocks of contiguous licenses, the other 21 MHz comes from the BRS1, E4, F4, and K blocks, which are located at the very bottom of BRS/EBS and/or not fully contiguous with the "attributable" 55.5 MHz. So, for TD-LTE deployment, that 55.5 MHz is likely to be the heart and soul.

 

http://s4gru.com/ind..._200#entry82163

 

AJ

[lynyrd65]

Honestly it might be nice to divest some 2.5ghz to another carrier. Maybe they'll bring it to some city outside of Sprint's home area for some nifty LTE roaming.

 

Maybe they'll also come to their senses and deploy LTE at 1900 (but that's really asking a lot, i think?)

[JohnnyAwesome]

I think Sprint is fully prepared to give up EBS spectrum. It has almost no value. It is better geared for local ISP use anyway. Trying to manage 400 separate leases with varying terms and expirations has been a nightmare for Clearwire. Also, who wants to go spend a lot of money installing a network in a market using EBS spectrum on a lease that expires in one or two years and the educational institution comes back with unreasonable demands? It's a nightmare scenario. About 1/3 of Clearwire EBS leases expire in the next two years. And some EBS lessees are planning a big show down.

 

Robert via Samsung Note II via Tapatalk

 

 

Agreed that EBS isn't a very good match for Sprint with control over Clear. They will still have plenty of BRS spectrum to work with. Hopefully the EBS spectrum will get to put to use. I hope maybe universities could partner with local gov/ and or ISP's to setup small community systems to serve under served both economically and due to broadband coverage issues. But this is about Sprint not building Muninetworks

[Deval]

Brings up another question (I'm full of those apparently!), if the EBS bands were created solely for universities and other institutions, how were they planning on deploying those bands?

[lordsutch]

My understanding is Clearwire (and maybe others) leased the EBS spectrum from the universities, since they weren't usually using it for anything; the original idea as I understand it was for extension services and remote teleconferencing, but the 2.5GHz band really doesn't have the range to be useful as anything more than a campus-area network with omindirectional antennas (you could use it for microwave relays, but my guess is these days fixed sites are much better served by landline connections).

[S4GRU]

EBS is pretty old spectrum. However, it was only recently opened up to mobile broadband usage. I think in 2006. Clearwire used it for its fixed wireless Expedience system since 2003.

 

Robert via Nexus 7 on Tapatalk

 

 

[Deval]

EBS is pretty old spectrum. However, it was only recently opened up to mobile broadband usage. I think in 2006. Clearwire used it for its fixed wireless Expedience system since 2003.

 

Robert via Nexus 7 on Tapatalk

 

Ah makes sense now.

[stitch1007]

Never mind

Edited January 9, 2013 by stitch1007

[marschp]

Almost every bit of NV-centric training in the retail stores has talked about 2500>1900>800 from the beginning. I don't think it was ever a matter of if it was going to happen, but rather just a matter of exactly how it was going to happen.

 

I'm sure back when NV was being concocted by the Network teams they were already considering a possible buyout of Clearwire (just missing the cash for it).

 

The Clearwire purchase hinges entirely on the Softbank deal, if it is not approved, no Clearwire purchase. Simple as that. This is probably why equipment for 2500 was not included in the NV process, Sprint would not have the cash for all of it, Softbank however is a different story (More than twice the market cap of Sprint as of today).

 

Sprint has already got $3.1bn from Softbank in the form of a convertible loan - I think this enables them to do Clearwire irrespective of whether the SB/Sprint deal gets approved - if the deal is blocked then SB will simply be a lender to Sprint rather than a shareholder/owner. Having bid $2.2bn for Clearwire, there is even some scope for Sprint to up the bid in the event of a counterbid (like the one from Dish). The issue, if the SB/Sprint deal is turned down, is how Sprint will fund the rollout of the 2500 spectrum from Clearwire, given that the second installment of cash from SB (4.4bn) would not be forthcoming.

[halcyoncmdr]

Sprint has already got $3.1bn from Softbank in the form of a convertible loan - I think this enables them to do Clearwire irrespective of whether the SB/Sprint deal gets approved - if the deal is blocked then SB will simply be a lender to Sprint rather than a shareholder/owner.  Having bid $2.2bn for Clearwire, there is even some scope for Sprint to up the bid in the event of a counterbid (like the one from Dish). The issue, if the SB/Sprint deal is turned down, is how Sprint will fund the rollout of the 2500 spectrum from Clearwire, given that the second installment of cash from SB (4.4bn) would not be forthcoming.

 

That's why I assume it won't happen if the SoftBank deal doesn't happen... Sprint had to Create the new Clearwire because they didn't have the cash to deploy a new network. Even with the 3.1B already, Sprint won't have the capital again without SoftBank. So I don't forsee it happening even though Sprint has the cash on hand to buy Clearwire.

[WiWavelength]

So I don't forsee it happening even though Sprint has the cash on hand to buy Clearwire.

 

You just used "forsee" and "Sprint" in the same sentence. That is no longer allowed. Did you not get the memo?

 

But I will let it slide just this once, as I assume that you meant "foresee," and this was just a Freudian slip

 

AJ