Everything 800mhz (1xA, LTE, coverage, timeline, etc)

[Dkoellerwx]

I know the device reports its location for 911, but I believe the sites do as well.. something must report the location of the site, because (at least in MA) I know the 911 system can triangulate the position of a wireless caller on an older non-GPS device.

 

In MA and NH, every Sprint site I have found uses the offset.  Every US Cellular site I have roamed on in NH reports the exact location, so I know it's not me or my app

 

-Mike

 

Every site I've encountered in the Midwest (plains, whatever you call it) have had the offset as well.

[tongboy]

I know the device reports its location for 911, but I believe the sites do as well.. something must report the location of the site, because (at least in MA) I know the 911 system can triangulate the position of a wireless caller on an older non-GPS device.

 

In MA and NH, every Sprint site I have found uses the offset. Every US Cellular site I have roamed on in NH reports the exact location, so I know it's not me or my app

 

-Mike

Your app is amazing and I was not questioning it at all. I use it all the time. It amazes techs from Ericsson that I have run into. I was trying to say (poorly) is there seems to be a lower level that e911 has access to that we in user land do not. I really was hoping we could piece together some pattern that the offsets would make sense...

 

From what I have heard over police radio they can pinpoint the same gps and network coordinates your app reports.

 

Sent from my EVO LTE

 

 

[tongboy]

Every site I've encountered in the Midwest (plains, whatever you call it) have had the offset as well.

Was the offset always the same in a market ?

 

Sent from my EVO LTE

 

 

[lordsutch]

My guess is that offset coordinates are favored for E911, since they are statistically more likely to be close to the device location than coordinates based on the tower location.  In theory that should make A-GPS location acquisition faster/more accurate for E911 purposes, although in practice I'm not sure it helps that much compared to other, more precise A-GPS methods like wifi-based positioning and having a cached ephemeris for the GPS and GLONASS constellations.

[mikejeep]

Your app is amazing and I was not questioning it at all. I use it all the time. It amazes techs from Ericsson that I have run into.

Oh haha I'm sorry, I had no intention of sounding defensive.. I didn't think you were questioning me! I just wanted to provide a point of reference.

 

I was trying to say (poorly) is there seems to be a lower level that e911 has access to that we in user land do not. I really was hoping we could piece together some pattern that the offsets would make sense...

 

From what I have heard over police radio they can pinpoint the same gps and network coordinates your app reports.

That's why I was wondering if every site's true coordinates are programmed into the equipment somehow, and there is a setting that makes the "public" coordinates offset. I have ZERO clue how base station equipment works; this is just a hypothetical guess.

 

As far as the 911 stuff goes, the capabilities vary by state. I am very familiar with how MA works because I have experience with their equipment; it is mandated that every cellular 911 call received in the state reports the location of the cell site the call is coming from (it pops up as the street address as well as lat/long), along with the coordinates of the device the call is coming from (if the device is capable). It either uses the device's GPS information or attempts to triangulate it. I believe the sector direction (N/NE/SW/E, etc.) is also displayed with the tower info. The dispatcher immediately sees all of the information available and can refresh the locations with the click of a mouse.

 

I am just curious where the coordinates of the site come from--the site itself, or some sort of external database maintained by the cellular provider? Seems like it would be much simpler if it was coming directly from the site, but again.. I have no experience with that aspect of things. I just know the data gets to the 911 screen somehow.

 

-Mike

[IamMrFamous07]

I just wish Sprint and softbank can keep us updated with 800 1x rollout and can give us a concrete date when they plan to roll out 800 LTE and deploy more of 2.5 LTE too.

 

 

We only get some of that information during their quarterly conference calls.

[lilotimz]

*Looks at the LTE 800 & TD-LTE 2500/2600 map(s) in the premier sponsor area*

 

mhmmm..

[Rukin1]

I understand the 'chaotic' nature of a massive nationwide rollout that, despite what some people think, is very fast-paced considering the scale of the project.  I work with many different communications contractors at worksites quite often, and most of them don't receive their assignments until they show up for work that morning.  Don't forget, while there are only three vendors responsible for different geographical areas, there are many many smaller contractors doing the actual work.  And some sites probably have more than one company doing difference pieces of the puzzle.

 

However, do find it a little surprising that a specification such as how to set the base station coordinates wasn't explicitly given on either a national or at least "Big 3" level.  It's a piece of programming you would expect to be on a checklist somewhere.  I would somewhat understand if offsets were an Alcatel-Lucent thing and actual locations were an Ericsson thing.. but it just seems to be random, with pockets of true coordinates in scattered areas, and offsets in others.

 

From a technical standpoint, I believe each site's true coordinates are configured somewhere for E-911 purposes, correct?  Perhaps there is a "publicly broadcast offset location" bit somewhere that some contractors enable, and some don't?

 

-Mike

So contractors hired contractors?

[IamMrFamous07]

*Looks at the LTE 800 & TD-LTE 2500/2600 map(s) in the premier sponsor area*

 

mhmmm..

 

Is it worth paying the $100 for the premier sponsor?

[lilotimz]

The "Le Premier Sponsor Lounge, BBQ, Chicken Fry, and Media Screening Room" is worth $100 by itself. The maps are priceless. 

[digiblur]

So contractors hired contractors?

Yep and those contractors hired more contractors.

[lordsutch]

That's why I was wondering if every site's true coordinates are programmed into the equipment somehow, and there is a setting that makes the "public" coordinates offset. I have ZERO clue how base station equipment works; this is just a hypothetical guess.

CDMA 1x (and I think most other modern cell systems) requires GPS time synchronization for the network to actually work properly, hence why each site has a GPS antenna on it (and partially why AIRAVEs need an occasional GPS lock, in addition to regulatory compliance). Whether the hardware actually uses the position information from GPS in addition to the time, or just uses something hardcoded, I don't know.

 

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk 4

[digiblur]

I would imagine they use the GPS antenna location. I mean if contractors can mess up something such as hooking up the sectors in the wrong order and then signing off on it then definitely the GPS location would be wrong on many sites. Just all in statistics.

[JimBob]

Is it worth paying the $100 for the premier sponsor?

 

Becoming a premier sponsor changed my life.

[IamMrFamous07]

Becoming a premier sponsor changed my life.

Lol how? Sell me on the premier sponsor

[DaQue]

Yep and those contractors hired more contractors.

hehehe one of them in the STL area wasn't licensed and another crew has to go to the tower take the panels and coax cables off and put it back up. 

 

http://s4gru.com/index.php?/topic/975-network-visionlte-missouri-market-includes-st-louis/page-213&do=findComment&comment=188743

[digiblur]

hehehe one of them in the STL area wasn't licensed and another crew has to go to the tower take the panels and coax off and put it back up.

Nice! I hope they don't put coax back though. RRUs prefer power and fiber.

 

Wish they would come reinstall a couple sites in this area. Some are downright awesome work.. Some.. Err.. Not so much.

 

 

[DaQue]

Nice! I hope they don't put coax back though. RRUs prefer power and fiber.

 

Wish they would come reinstall a couple sites in this area. Some are downright awesome work.. Some.. Err.. Not so much.

Yup fiber I goofed.

[digiblur]

Yup fiber I goofed.

Messing with ya.. Easy to forget. Technically there is coax though. Just very short pieces.

[cdk]

Is it worth paying the $100 for the premier sponsor?

 

I don't know, but I hope to find out eventually. Of course I sometimes feel like I have cursed myself for what I have already learned as a sponsor.

 

[peteyz24]

Is it worth paying the $100 for the premier sponsor?

The question is. Is the information you have already received from this site worth $100 of your money to help keep the lights on around here?  The premier forum is just a bonus.

[IamMrFamous07]

The question is. Is the information you have already received from this site worth $100 of your money to help keep the lights on around here? The premier forum is just a bonus.

I paid the $100

[The Dave]

This is all off topic but since it is important, I will chime in. I do feel, regardless of the extra privileges you receive, if you use this site and like the content, it is the right thing to do to donate what you can. I feel that Robert and all the moderators and contributors take a lot of time, effort and stress to keep this place going. It isn't a matter of if the premium sponsorship is worth it, but if you feel the work they put into this community is worth it. I cannot afford the premium tier, but I have donated a little bit twice so far this month just because I feel I should acknowledge their effort and at least pay for some of the bandwidth I use up to learn everything I can.

[SpenceSouth]

I paid with my tuition loan money....  I figured its fitting if it enhances my education.  Right?

[Guest tuwsy]

Yep and those contractors hired more contractors.

Do nokia, Ericsson, Alu have permanent presence in America?