Everything 800mhz (1xA, LTE, coverage, timeline, etc)

[prophead]

Seems LTE is generating all the Network vision excitement, but what I am curious about is 800mhz CDMA....

 

At what point in the Network Vision upgrade process does 800mhz CDMA become live?

 

Also....

 

From my experience 3.5 miles is about the max for a usable 1900 mhz CDMA signal. What is the average real world usable distance for 800 mhz CDMA?

[NiteSnow]

Seems LTE is generating all the Network vision excitement, but what I am curious about is 800mhz CDMA....

 

At what point in the Network Vision upgrade process does 800mhz CDMA become live?

 

Also....

 

From my experience 3.5 miles is about the max for a usable 1900 mhz CDMA signal. What is the average real world usable distance for 800 mhz CDMA?

 

I've been 10 miles out with NLOS and signal was about -96dBm which isn't the best but it'll let you make calls and do some mild web browsing.

[WiWavelength]

From my experience 3.5 miles is about the max for a usable 1900 mhz CDMA signal. What is the average real world usable distance for 800 mhz CDMA?

 

Generalizing in this regard serves little purpose, as the number of variables is quite great. Just know that, at the same power levels, SMR 800 MHz has ~7 dB free space path loss advantage over PCS 1900 MHz. Additionally, 3.5 miles is certainly not the maximum usable propagation distance for CDMA1X 1900.

 

AJ

[prophead]

Generalizing in this regard serves little purpose, as the number of variables is quite great. Additionally, 3.5 miles is certainly not the maximum usable propagation distance for CDMA1X 1900.

 

Got it and not saying it was I was just looking for the average. In my part of Central PA there is rolling hills, small towns and woods patches. In this type of terrain I find a pretty consistent 3-3.5 miles till I start to see a signal strength of about -100db.

 

SMR 800 MHz has ~7 dB free space path loss advantage over PCS 1900 MHz.

 

Thank you! That information is very helpful.

 

Now does anybody now at what point in NV this 800mhz SMR gets activated?

[WiWavelength]

Now does anybody now at what point in NV this 800mhz SMR gets activated?

 

Because of the need for iDEN shutdown first, LTE 800 is a separate, later stage in Network Vision. While activation will vary from site to site, CDMA1X 800 is part of Network Vision from the get go.

 

AJ

[S4GRU]

I have not seen a definite CDMA 800 schedule. However, we know that some CDMA 800 sites are already live in Network Vision areas. But their deployment is much slower and appears less organized. I believe that Sprint is clearing enough iDEN channels to allow CDMA on Channel 476 as a part of this years iDEN thinning exercise. I do expect CDMA 800 deployment to pick up steam later this year.

 

Robert via CM9 Kindle Fire using Forum Runner

[DataHawg]

So the current Sprint LTE phones can use 800mhz?

[Mercurial1]

So the current Sprint LTE phones can use 800mhz?

 

They can use voice and 1x on 800 but no current device supports LTE on 800

 

Sent from my EVO using Tapatalk 2

[WiWavelength]

So the current Sprint LTE phones can use 800mhz?

 

Going back more than a year, numerous Sprint handsets have included support for CDMA1X 800.

 

AJ

[Geekslayer]

I would think that any phone that has the capability to roam on Verizon is capable of 800mhz voice/3g ?

 

I guess I'm confused as well. Take it easy on me, I'm still trying to figure out why they took "Happy Days" off the air.

 

1. NV upgrades = immediate 800mhz Voice ?....1900pcs LTE? (On handsets that support it)

[WiWavelength]

I would think that any phone that has the capability to roam on Verizon is capable of 800mhz voice/3g ?

 

Nope, you are confusing Cellular 850 MHz with SMR 800 MHz. VZW has no SMR 800 MHz licenses.

 

AJ

[DataHawg]

Thanks for the quick replies. Thinking about upgrading from my rooted E4GT but with 800mhz LTE and LTE Advanced on the horizon, it might be worth waiting a few months. I'm pretty happy running ICS on this phone but the signal strength isn't great. Looking forward to the results of this test. Most users are saying signal strength on the S3 is better than the S2.

[WiWavelength]

Thanks for the quick replies. Thinking about upgrading from my rooted E4GT but with 800mhz LTE and LTE Advanced on the horizon, it might be worth waiting a few months.

 

I can practically promise you that Sprint will not offer any LTE Advanced capable handsets this year. And LTE 800 capability this year, while possible, is no given either.

 

Going off of the Network Vision roadmap, I would project that the big LTE 800 device push will be next year, and the big LTE Advanced device emphasis will not be until 2014.

 

So, on one hand, you can wait for additional options before you upgrade. But you will never get ahead of the curve. And the longer you wait, the longer your subsequent upgrade eligibility just gets pushed back.

 

Alternatively, you can upgrade now and be in position for another subsidized upgrade by this time in 2014, at which point the LTE Advanced 800 capabilities that you desire are likely to be readily available.

 

AJ

[S4GRU]

Also the LTE 800 network will still be in its infancy in 2014.

 

Robert via CM9 Kindle Fire using Forum Runner

[irev210]

I have not seen a definite CDMA 800 schedule. However, we know that some CDMA 800 sites are already live in Network Vision areas. But their deployment is much slower and appears less organized. I believe that Sprint is clearing enough iDEN channels to allow CDMA on Channel 476 as a part of this years iDEN thinning exercise. I do expect CDMA 800 deployment to pick up steam later this year.

 

Robert via CM9 Kindle Fire using Forum Runner

 

All of the hardware is being installed though, right? More of a function of clearing iDEN, not waiting for hardware (for 1x Advanced on the SMR band). Is it just a function of Sprint dispatching Ericsson to install the base station hardware, or is that ready to roll as well?

 

Just wondering how they will be rolling out 1x Advanced @ 800MHz vs. how they are rolling out network vision.

[Mercurial1]

Also the LTE 800 network will still be in its infancy in 2014.

 

Robert via CM9 Kindle Fire using Forum Runner

 

I have been wondering if we might see iden shuttered earlier than June. The iden thinning has started causing massive complaints and migrations from what I hear. I wonder how many nextel subs will be left by Christmas? And it may not even matter if sprint isn't ready for the change over.

 

Sent from my EVO using Tapatalk 2

[S4GRU]

All of the hardware is being installed though, right? More of a function of clearing iDEN, not waiting for hardware (for 1x Advanced on the SMR band). Is it just a function of Sprint dispatching Ericsson to install the base station hardware, or is that ready to roll as well?

 

Just wondering how they will be rolling out 1x Advanced @ 800MHz vs. how they are rolling out network vision.

 

It is my understanding that everything is being deployed now for one CDMA 800 carrier in Network Vision. However, 800 service has its own radio behind the panels. And in some deployment pictures, there are clearly two radios per panel and some clearly only show one. I think the ones with only one are not ready for 800 service, at least not with the RRU's.

 

I have been wondering if we might see iden shuttered earlier than June. The iden thinning has started causing massive complaints and migrations from what I hear. I wonder how many nextel subs will be left by Christmas? And it may not even matter if sprint isn't ready for the change over.

 

Sent from my EVO using Tapatalk 2

 

I imagine it's possible to start shutting down iDEN sooner if there is no one using it. However, officially, Sprint has said they will turn off the entire iDEN network on June 30, 2013. And everything I have seen behind the scenes supports that date. No move up yet. Also, everything I have seen doesn't have LTE 800 work beginning until the 2nd Half of 2013.

 

Even if the iDEN network is decommissioned earlier than 6/30/2013, Sprint may not be able to accelerate LTE 800 to be sooner at that time as the schedule may be too well defined by the point they decide to pull the plug earlier. Also, since the device ecosystem for LTE 800 will not be ready until probably some time in 2013, there is no sense of urgency to speed up LTE 800 deployment at this time.

 

Right now, there are so many variabilities, it can still go any way. LTE 800 FIT's are supposed to begin some time this Fall/Winter in the New Orleans market, and some secret location in Montana.

 

Robert

[kkstp09]

this should probably go in a separate thread but where will LTE-avdanced go? another spectrum or replace current LTE?

[S4GRU]

this should probably go in a separate thread but where will LTE-avdanced go? another spectrum or replace current LTE?

 

It will replace existing LTE carriers. For Sprint, it is just a software upgrade. LTE Advanced is backward compatible with LTE devices. It's just that LTE devices will not be able to use the advantages of LTE Advanced.

 

Most of the advantages of LTE Advanced have to do with Carrier Aggregation and additional MIMO support. It's just a LTE upgrade.

 

Robert

[Zander]

WOW LTE-Advanced, some of us are overwhelmed by Network Vision, we have dreams of LTE, we think LTE on 800MHz is like haven and then LTE-Advanced would be?????

[SpenceSouth]

There's a lot of great information floating around this forum about the 800mhz rollout. Unfortunately, it's not as easy to find as some of the great information about LTE. So what I hoped to do here is to consolidate this information and make it easier to discuss one of the biggest changes coming to Sprint during Network Vision.

 

I know a lot of this information is already scattered around the forum, but if you guys would help, lets make it more accessible.

 

To get the discussion started and for those to haven't found this info here yet...

 

On how many towers is 800mhz LTE and 1xA going to be deployed?

How quickly will 800mhz 1xA be deployed in NV areas?

What is the real world coverage increase going from a traditionally 1900mhz network to a 800mhz channel?

What PRL's would take the most advantage of 800mhz ESMR when it's available in your area?

 

My question is for those of you in Chicago and Texas... how big of a difference is it for you guys? I imagine the increase in coverage is probably astounding.

[ydoucare]

My question is for those of you in Chicago and Texas... how big of a difference is it for you guys? I imagine the increase in coverage is probably astounding.

 

From my experience, in areas where there is very poor LoS to the tower, 800 mhz provides a substantial improvement in signal/coverage. Even with clear LoS, there is a definite improvement and it's helped fill some small gaps where I live.

[SpenceSouth]

From my experience, in areas where there is very poor LoS to the tower, 800 mhz provides a substantial improvement in signal/coverage. Even with clear LoS, there is a definite improvement and it's helped fill some small gaps where I live.

 

That's really good. I think that, barring any interference issues, having 800mhz with 1900mhz spacing is going to be a huge win for Sprint. The coverage increase Sprint showed for Atlanta was mind-blowing.

[chrysokos]

I live in the northwest suburbs of Chicago. I also work at a small communications company that specializes in the repairs and sales of Sprint/ Nextel devices, as well as Kenwood and Motorola portable radios. The sheer amount of complaints from Sprint customers has been incredible the last 7 months in Chicago. NV is working in some areas, but some are getting left behind for whatever reason. Areas such as Carol Stream and Glendale Heights, I.L. Things have improved over the last month and continue to get better overall, but people are still dropping calls in areas at a unbelievable amount, compared to before NV. The new Sprint direct connect isn't anywhere near as good as Nextel was before the decommissioning began. I'm not bad mouthing Sprint one bit, I'm just letting the people know who are not in Chicago. Things are much better than a couple months ago, and LTE is great. Completion can't come soon enough though for those customers who have no reception in their homes and are dropping calls in their places of travel.

[jcrowder3]

I asked Robert about 800 Mhz earlier and the rollout will start after IDen network is shutdown mid 2013. They are doing testing, but since they need to determine the towers needed, they don't have that info now (It is topography and unrban buildup dependant).