Network Vision/LTE - New York City Market

[LTEBrooklyn]

 

 

Welcome to the forums! Keep an eye out for new spots of LTE and we'll send out someone with a real phone.. ah hmmm.. I mean android phone to map it!

 

Your right the iPhone 5 isn't a phone, it's a toy. I like toys though, so that's why I have one. Lol. Welcome to the forum.

[S4GRU]

Is NYC going to look like this on sprint when completed? I sure hope not. If this is 10x10 on Verizon, I can't imagine Verizon has a lot of happy NYC subscribers

 

No. Even in the Bronx they have only deployed on about every third site so far. Density will get greater and greater as deployment continues. When fully deployed, Sprint will likely equal or outperform Verizon and AT&T due to the greater site density. Verizon speeds have already started falling in many area. They are only above 10Mbps now in my area in the middle of the night.

 

Robert

[NaNa_Ch!LL]

 

 

No. Even in the Bronx they have only deployed on about every third site so far. Density will get greater and greater as deployment continues. When fully deployed, Sprint will likely equal or outperform Verizon and AT&T due to the greater site density. Verizon speeds have already started falling in many area. They are only above 10Mbps now in my area in the middle of the night.

 

Robert

 

What area is that?

[LTEBrooklyn]

 

 

No. Even in the Bronx they have only deployed on about every third site so far. Density will get greater and greater as deployment continues. When fully deployed, Sprint will likely equal or outperform Verizon and AT&T due to the greater site density. Verizon speeds have already started falling in many area. They are only above 10Mbps now in my area in the middle of the night.

 

Robert

 

I don't understand if Verizon started in 2010, why can't they be fully deployed by now? It will be almost three years.

[S4GRU]

What area is that?

 

Where I have been in New Mexico, Colorado, South Dakota, Nebraska and Texas the past few months. Sprint LTE was equal or better to Verizon LTE in fully deployed areas of Waco and Wichita Falls, Texas in my extensive device testing. I have two Verizon LTE devices and a T-Mobile HSPA+ device. I do not live in a Sprint vacuum.

 

I have steadily watched Verizon LTE speeds in the areas I go drop steadily. Originally 25Mbps+ in most places. Then down to 15. Then down to 10. Now averaging 3-6Mbps.

 

Additionally, it is well known by posts all over the place that Verizon LTE speeds are falling and they are running out of capacity. There are dozens of posts about it here in our forums as well. It is less likely to be an issue though in very urban areas like NYC, because Verizon does have greater site density there than they do in suburban locations.

 

Robert

[AndyNYC1]

finally getting my galaxy note 2 today. was going to wait for LG optimus G 2 or galaxy s4, but couldnt use my galaxy s any longer. i will try to go around parts of queens and see any place has LTE lit up.

 

Go check around Jamacia Ave maybe you'll spot one

[NaNa_Ch!LL]

 

 

Where I have been in New Mexico, Colorado, South Dakota, Nebraska and Texas the past few months. Sprint LTE was equal or better to Verizon LTE in fully deployed areas of Waco and Wichita Falls, Texas in my extensive device testing. I have two Verizon LTE devices and a T-Mobile HSPA+ device. I do not live in a Sprint vacuum.

 

I have steadily watched Verizon LTE speeds in the areas I go drop steadily. Originally 25Mbps+ in most places. Then down to 15. Then down to 10. Now averaging 3-6Mbps.

 

Additionally, it is well known by posts all over the place that Verizon LTE speeds are falling and they are running out of capacity. There are dozens of posts about it here in our forums as well. It is less likely to be an issue though in very urban areas like NYC, because Verizon does have greater site density there than they do in suburban locations.

 

Robert

 

Equal you say in fully deployed areas? Is that on the 1900 MHz spectrum only?

[S4GRU]

I don't understand if Verizon started in 2010, why can't they be fully deployed by now? It will be almost three years.

 

I was speaking about Sprint, but you do raise a good point. Sprint will finish it's LTE deployment start to finish sooner than Verizon. And a lot of people bag on Sprint as if they can do it even faster than they are. Sprint's LTE deployment is far more complex than Verizon's, on almost double the sites. All things considered, Sprint is flying. And the deployment is unprecedented in wireless history, especially when you consider the scope of work.

 

Robert

[AndyNYC1]

I see that around East 59 street and East 96 street there's a LTE signal checkout the sensorly map!

[LTEBrooklyn]

I see that around East 59 street and East 96 street there's a LTE signal checkout the sensorly map!

 

Wow that looks like a weak signal on East 96

[S4GRU]

Equal you say in fully deployed areas? Is that on the 1900 MHz spectrum only?

 

Yes. In places where there is already full site density deployment. I did LTE device testing in Wichita Falls, Texas over Thanksgiving weekend. On the north side of the city, the network is already fully deployed on almost all sites. In all the areas of full deployment, with a full strength LTE signal, Sprint LTE averaged 33Mbps. Verizon LTE averaged 20Mbps with a full signal. The peak speed achieved on Sprint LTE was 37.5Mbps. The peak speed on Verizon LTE never went above 25Mbps in all our testing. And this was with several devices.

 

When we were outside areas of full deployment and did testing, Sprint had weaker signals and the speeds did fall to 3-10Mbps. In those areas, Verizon was still averaging 15-20Mbps, because they are fully deployed in those areas. When Sprint LTE is fully deployed in the same areas, the speeds will go up as well.

 

Sprint's LTE on 1900 maxes out at 37.5Mbps speeds with a 5x5 LTE carrier. Which is more than sufficient. Sprint also is more likely to keep their speeds up because they will have a lot more network capacity in any given area because it takes more PCS 1900 sites than LTE on 750 (and Sprint has half the customers to serve from each site). Also, Sprint has more options for additional LTE carriers, because they only need to dig up spectrum for 5MHz channels, instead of wider 10MHz channels.

 

Sprint has a solid LTE capacity advantage with its deployment. Except in very urban areas. In very urban areas, even 700MHz LTE carriers have to make their network dense. So Sprint does not have a density advantage in places like New York. But they will in places like LA, most of Chicago, and almost all other Top 100 markets.

 

Robert

[LTEBrooklyn]

 

 

Yes. In places where there is already full site density deployment. I did LTE device testing in Wichita Falls, Texas over Thanksgiving weekend. On the north side of the city, the network is already fully deployed on almost all sites. In all the areas of full deployment, with a full strength LTE signal, Sprint LTE averaged 33Mbps. Verizon LTE averaged 20Mbps with a full signal. The peak speed achieved on Sprint LTE was 37.5Mbps. The peak speed on Verizon LTE never went above 25Mbps in all our testing. And this was with several devices.

 

When we were outside areas of full deployment and did testing, Sprint had weaker signals and the speeds did fall to 3-10Mbps. In those areas, Verizon was still averaging 15-20Mbps, because they are fully deployed in those areas. When Sprint LTE is fully deployed in the same areas, the speeds will go up as well.

 

Sprint's LTE on 1900 maxes out at 37.5Mbps speeds with a 5x5 LTE carrier. Which is more than sufficient. Sprint also is more likely to keep their speeds up because they will have a lot more network capacity in any given area because it takes more PCS 1900 sites than LTE on 750 (and Sprint has half the customers to serve from each site). Also, Sprint has more options for additional LTE carriers, because they only need to dig up spectrum for 5MHz channels, instead of wider 10MHz channels.

 

Sprint has a solid LTE capacity advantage with its deployment. Except in very urban areas. In very urban areas, even 700MHz LTE carriers have to make their network dense. So Sprint does not have a density advantage in places like New York. But they will in places like LA, most of Chicago, and almost all other Top 100 markets.

 

Robert

 

So in other words in NY once sprint is fully deployed we will never see the full potential speed because it won't be dense enough?

[S4GRU]

 

So in other words in NY once sprint is fully deployed we will never see the full potential speed because it won't be dense enough?

 

Wow. That is not what I said at all. You will need to re-read that. If you have follow up questions about anything specifically, let me know.

 

Robert via Samsung Note II via Tapatalk

 

 

[LTEBrooklyn]

 

 

Wow. That is not what I said at all. You will need to re-read that. If you have follow up questions about anything specifically, let me know.

 

Robert via Samsung Note II via Tapatalk

 

Sorry. Your right after rereading that, I see it's quite different. Sorry I just have a lot of questions some time and I'm trying to get a full understanding.

[S4GRU]

 

Sorry. Your right after rereading that, I see it's quite different. Sorry I just have a lot of questions some time and I'm trying to get a full understanding.

 

No problem. If that's the worst thing that happens today, then it was a very good day.

 

Robert via Samsung Note II via Tapatalk

 

 

[enyce9]

For those of you who live in Westchester. I just drove by this site in Elmsford NY, Rt 9A receiving a much needed panel upgrade.

 

Sent from my EVO using Tapatalk 2

[NaNa_Ch!LL]

Ah, so in a way Sprint will benefit from LTE on 1900 MHz. More towers are needed to cover an area as opposed to one 750 MHz. What youre saying is that the more people that join Verizon, the more loaded that one tower will be. Unlike Sprint which will have multiple towers (and half the subscribers) that won't be overcrowded. Makes sense that LTE speed in this case should stay top notch.

[S4GRU]

Ah, so in a way Sprint will benefit from LTE on 1900 MHz. More towers are needed to cover an area as opposed to one 750 MHz. What youre saying is that the more people that join Verizon, the more loaded that one tower will be. Unlike Sprint which will have multiple towers (and half the subscribers) that won't be overcrowded. Makes sense that LTE speed in this case should stay top notch.

 

Yes, exactly. It costs Sprint a lot more to deploy so many sites. But the advantage is increased capacity.

 

Robert via Samsung Note II via Tapatalk

 

 

[NaNa_Ch!LL]

 

 

Yes, exactly. It costs Sprint a lot more to deploy so many sites. But the advantage is increased capacity.

 

Robert via Samsung Note II via Tapatalk

 

Hopefully it pays off well. Will they eventually do LTE on the 800 MHz band?

[S4GRU]

 

Hopefully it pays off well. Will they eventually do LTE on the 800 MHz band?

 

Yes. Sprint will be adding LTE 800 to approx. 80% of their sites starting in the 2nd half of 2013.

 

Robert via Samsung Note II via Tapatalk

 

 

[AndyNYC1]

Today I passed by Queens College Around reeves ave and kissena Blvd and saw some workers adding new LTE panels up on a tower. Maybe it was sprint upgrading there panels and adding LTE Radios

[NaNa_Ch!LL]

 

 

Yes. Sprint will be adding LTE 800 to approx. 80% of their sites starting in the 2nd half of 2013.

 

Robert via Samsung Note II via Tapatalk

 

That'll be nice for some more indoor coverage. ????

 

Nice to know Andy. I think queens will be seeing more of me next semester.

[LTEBrooklyn]

Today I passed by Queens College Around reeves ave and kissena Blvd and saw some workers adding new LTE panels up on a tower. Maybe it was sprint upgrading there panels and adding LTE Radios

 

What do LTE panels look like ?

[doug526]

What do LTE panels look like ?

 

There is no such thing as an LTE panel. LTE is just a carrier technology. LTE antenna panels are impossible to distinguish from other panels to the inexperienced cell site spotter. LTE - CDMA - GSM - HSPA antennas - they all can look the same, and there can be many different carrier technologies transmitting from any individual antenna. They can come in any size and shape.

 

Instead, the antenna can be distinguished based on which RF frequencies it uses. So a 1900-MHz-only antenna will be tall and skinny and typically have 1 or 2 coax connections, while a 800/1900 antenna will be thicker to handle the larger waveform of the lower frequency. It will also have 4 or sometimes 6 RF coax connector ports on the bottom of it.

 

Here in Texas, AT&T uses large panels that support all cellular bands between 700-850 megahertz and 1700-2100 megahertz. Those antennas are broadcasting LTE at 700, GSM/HSPA at 850, and GSM/HSPA at 1900. On Verizon, they are starting to install new antennas that use LTE at 700, CDMA at 1900, and LTE at 1700/2100.

 

Sprint's new antennas support 800 and 1900 (possibly more?) and will be eventually using CDMA and LTE on both frequencies.

[S4GRU]

On Verizon, they are starting to install new antennas that use LTE at 700, CDMA at 1900, and LTE at 1700/2100.

 

In my area Verizon uses a LTE panel by itself. And has additional CDMA 850 panels beside them.

 

Robert