10MHz by 10MHz LTE 1900 band

[Fraydog]

Isn't it 20x20 and not 40?

Yes, to clarify, that's what I meant but didn't word it right.

 

 

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[S4GRU]

Yes, to clarify, that's what I meant but didn't word it right.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

The full 20MHz markets are the only places where Sprint has a chance of deploying a 10MHz carrier.  These have been what I was talking about today.  St. Louis included.  But St. Louis has a better shot because they did not have the new USCC spectrum tied up with legacy CDMA.  It's already free and clear.  Chicago, Columbus and Cleveland also being in a similar situation.  But most other markets are not in this good of shape.  

 

However, there would have been many more if Sprint had purchased MetroPCS like Hesse wanted.  And Tmo wouldn't be so strong.  The Sprint Board is being judged historically as stupid on that move.

[bigsnake49]

The full 20MHz markets are the only places where Sprint has a chance of deploying a 10MHz carrier.  These have been what I was talking about today.  St. Louis included.  But St. Louis has a better shot because they did not have the new USCC spectrum tied up with legacy CDMA.  It's already free and clear.  Chicago, Columbus and Cleveland also being in a similar situation.  But most other markets are not in this good of shape.  

 

However, there would have been many more if Sprint had purchased MetroPCS like Hesse wanted.  And Tmo wouldn't be so strong.  The Sprint Board is being judged historically as stupid on that move.

While they were at it they could have rolled up Leap as well. Then trade AWS to AT&T for additional PCS capacity. Sprint's board has been totally stupid. 

[S4GRU]

While they were at it they could have rolled up Leap as well. Then trade AWS to AT&T for additional PCS capacity. Sprint's board has been totally stupid. 

 

No arguments there.  Sprint would be sitting in a much better position with Leap and MetroPCS.  They could have sold off or traded AWS.  Or even kept it now they are adding B4 to their devices.  But by any measure I can think of, MetroPCS and Leap would have been good moves for Sprint.  

 

But then, why stop there?  Sprint should have also took over Alltel.  And Sprint cannot let anyone else come up with USCC if it should ever be on the market.  Or we will all be saying that too.

[bigsnake49]

No arguments there.  Sprint would be sitting in a much better position with Leap and MetroPCS.  They could have sold off or traded AWS.  Or even kept it now they are adding B4 to their devices.  But by any measure I can think of, MetroPCS and Leap would have been good moves for Sprint.  

 

But then, why stop there?  Sprint should have also took over Alltel.  And Sprint cannot let anyone else come up with USCC if it should ever be on the market.  Or we will all be saying that too.

Don't even start me up on Alltel. Here was a company with very low debt and well build rural network, good brand name pleading with Sprint to merge. Would have been a great company to have merged with before the Nextel merger. They better merge with USCC if they ever come on the market. We cannot blame the FCC or the big Two. Sprint had its chance to become bigger and gain coverage credibility in the process if they ever went away from the urban/suburban mentality.

[WiWavelength]

Don't even start me up on Alltel. Here was a company with very low debt and well build rural network, good brand name pleading with Sprint to merge. Would have been a great company to have merged with before the Nextel merger. They better merge with USCC if they ever come on the market. We cannot blame the FCC or the big Two. Sprint had its chance to become bigger and gain coverage credibility in the process if they ever went away from the urban/suburban mentality.

 

We seem to rehash this revisionist history fantasy every few months.  Maybe we are just wireless industry masturbators.  Okay, well, lather up and go to town.

 

If given a choice, would Sprint have been better off now with Nextel and its nationwide portfolio of SMR 800 MHz spectrum plus substantial contributions of BRS/EBS 2600 MHz spectrum or with Alltel and its rural/select major market collection of Cellular 850 MHz spectrum?

 

And do not say both Nextel and Alltel -- because it probably could not have been done.  The choice is exclusive.

 

AJ

[Conan Kudo]

We seem to rehash this revisionist history fantasy every few months.  Maybe we are just wireless industry masturbators.  Okay, well, lather up and go to town.

 

If given a choice, would Sprint have been better off now with Nextel and its nationwide portfolio of SMR 800 MHz spectrum plus substantial contributions of BRS/EBS 2600 MHz spectrum or with Alltel and its rural/select major market collection of Cellular 850 MHz spectrum?

 

And do not say both Nextel and Alltel -- because it probably could not have been done.  The choice is exclusive.

 

AJ

Eww on the imagery.

 

In any case... As they say: hindsight's a bitch.

 

Knowing what we know now, Alltel would have been a better choice for a couple of reasons: the acquisition of that network would have cut Verizon off at the knees, and given them the profits and power to keep buying smaller companies to put together a national 850MHz footprint, as Verizon has done. Of course, we'd be sitting here cheering for Verizon instead of Sprint now, because Sprint would have become the duopolist along with AT&T instead of Verizon.

 

While it's true Nextel provided a truly national ESMR footprint that extends all the way to the territories, and granted Sprint a similarly national PCS G block footprint, the ever-increasing costs and amount of time involved in realizing the full benefits of that transaction make me believe that it wasn't worth it.

 

That said, the choice was made and Sprint is finally starting to realize the benefits of the Nextel acquisition. The PCS G footprint was cleaned up and ready to go soon after issuance (some UPCS work to free up the uplink, and BAS relocation on the downlink). The ESMR footprint is finally being realized, many years after the original projected transition completion date. We're nearing that pot of gold for Sprint.

[GoWireless]

Unless it's a penis measuring contest, raw speeds are nothing if a depressing thing to brag about.

 

Also, a 10x10 would require contiguous spectrum, adjacent to G-Block, which Sprint does not have nationwide.

...

A couple of things...

 

If by 10x10 you mean combine 5Mhz in the F block and 5Mhz in the G block to form a 10Mhz wide block, well, I don't think that would work (at least not without deploying another 5Mhz LTE block somewhere else in A-E). The reason being that I believe some of Sprint's earlier handsets could only do 5Mhz BW on LTE and if there isn't a 5Mhz block deployed somewhere in B25 then those handsets couldn't do LTE on B25 at all.

 

As for the ePenis measuring contests... You are absolutely correct. The vast vast majority of people out there care about their overall experience, not max throughput. Assuming reasonable latency, for most folks, 3-4Mbps for web browsing and 5-6Mbps for video is plenty sufficient.

[WiWavelength]

A couple of things...

 

If by 10x10 you mean combine 5Mhz in the F block and 5Mhz in the G block to form a 10Mhz wide block...

 

The PCS F block is not contiguous with the PCS G block.  The PCS C block, more specifically, the PCS C5 disaggregation is adjacent to the PCS G block.

 

AJ

[bigsnake49]

We seem to rehash this revisionist history fantasy every few months.  Maybe we are just wireless industry masturbators.  Okay, well, lather up and go to town.

 

If given a choice, would Sprint have been better off now with Nextel and its nationwide portfolio of SMR 800 MHz spectrum plus substantial contributions of BRS/EBS 2600 MHz spectrum or with Alltel and its rural/select major market collection of Cellular 850 MHz spectrum?

 

And do not say both Nextel and Alltel -- because it probably could not have been done.  The choice is exclusive.

 

AJ

Why not both? Verizon was born out of the merger of three companies. I believe so was T-Mobile.

[bigsnake49]

Eww on the imagery.

 

In any case... As they say: hindsight's a bitch.

 

Knowing what we know now, Alltel would have been a better choice for a couple of reasons: the acquisition of that network would have cut Verizon off at the knees, and given them the profits and power to keep buying smaller companies to put together a national 850MHz footprint, as Verizon has done. Of course, we'd be sitting here cheering for Verizon instead of Sprint now, because Sprint would have become the duopolist along with AT&T instead of Verizon.

 

While it's true Nextel provided a truly national ESMR footprint that extends all the way to the territories, and granted Sprint a similarly national PCS G block footprint, the ever-increasing costs and amount of time involved in realizing the full benefits of that transaction make me believe that it wasn't worth it.

 

That said, the choice was made and Sprint is finally starting to realize the benefits of the Nextel acquisition. The PCS G footprint was cleaned up and ready to go soon after issuance (some UPCS work to free up the uplink, and BAS relocation on the downlink). The ESMR footprint is finally being realized, many years after the original projected transition completion date. We're nearing that pot of gold for Sprint.

Having worked on a few projects with PS, I can tell you the original schedule was wildly optimistic by far. It did not help that Sprint was financially tapped and could not subsidize the whole relocation thing without having to wait for the relocation to be finance by PS and then reimbursing them for it. If they could have cleared couple of CDMA channels nationwide early in the rebinding process one for 1x and the other for EVDO they would have been golden.

 

AS AJ mentioned above, 800SMR is truly nationwide. Acquiring Alltel and other rural companies would not have given Sprint 850MHz spectrum in Manhattan to help with building penetration or in suburbia to help with propagation. It would have given them coverage credibility. They could have densified they urban/suburban network organically.

[WiWavelength]

Knowing what we know now, Alltel would have been a better choice for a couple of reasons: the acquisition of that network would have cut Verizon off at the knees, and given them the profits and power to keep buying smaller companies to put together a national 850MHz footprint, as Verizon has done. Of course, we'd be sitting here cheering for Verizon instead of Sprint now, because Sprint would have become the duopolist along with AT&T instead of Verizon.

 

No, Sprint would have cut off AT&T, not VZW.

 

Largely because of its AirTouch nee US West legacy across about half of the geographic area of the country, VZW already had a nearly nationwide constructed footprint prior to the Alltel acquisition.  Alltel just filled in some roaming gaps here and there.  But AT&T was the one with the gaping hole in the Great Plains and Intermountain West.  Luckily for Ma Bell, divestments of overlapping markets fell right into its lap.

 

Now, that I would not have minded -- keeping non American GSM sparse and poor across most of the rural West.  Only those aforementioned divestments allowed AT&T massively to expand its GSM/W-CDMA footprint.  Before the fallout from the Alltel acquisition, CDMA2000 ruled low band spectrum west of the Mississippi.  AT&T and T-Mobile had to live off the scraps of the former WWC GSM roamer network.  Those were sweet times.

 

AJ

[GoWireless]

The PCS F block is not contiguous with the PCS G block. The PCS C block, more specifically, the PCS C5 disaggregation is adjacent to the PCS G block.

 

AJ

OK, thanks for the correction though regardless, the concept still stands... because of the legacy 5Mhz BW device limitation you couldn't use an adjacent frequency to deploy a 10Mhz (or wider) block including the G block without supplying some other 5Mhz block in B25.

Edited March 4, 2015 by GoWireless

[cdk]

Alltel or even the remains of Alltel would have been a nice acquisition. If it is an either or choice between Nextel and Alltel, I am not sure what is the right answer. Allthough Nextel and the remains of Alltel was a possibilty. Same with either MetroPCS or Leap, both would have helped, but I think Hesse was right and the board was wrong, but it is unfortunately in the past.

 

 (Stupid board)

 

 

And Sprint cannot let anyone else come up with USCC if it should ever be on the market.  Or we will all be saying that too.

 

I think that can be expanded to most if not all of the remaining regional carriers. All though I don't think they need to wait for nTelos to hang the for sale sign... Hostile takeover FTW in that situation.

[bigsnake49]

Alltel or even the remains of Alltel would have been a nice acquisition. If it is an either or choice between Nextel and Alltel, I am not sure what is the right answer. Allthough Nextel and the remains of Alltel was a possibilty. Same with either MetroPCS or Leap, both would have helped, but I think Hesse was right and the board was wrong, but it is unfortunately in the past.

 

 (Stupid board)

 

 

 

I think that can be expanded to most if not all of the remaining regional carriers. All though I don't think they need to wait for nTelos to hang the for sale sign... Hostile takeover FTW in that situation.

USCC and C Spire would be at the top of my list. USCC, Alltel and RCC (?) were good targets in the mid 2000's.

[Fraydog]

Here's where I have to disagree with Sprint only being able to get one - Sprint bought Nextel too high. If they took Alltel first, they'd have better revenue and not have to engage in a "merger of equals". They would have been able to buy Nextel at a much lower price and make faster progress clearing Nextel spectrum for CDMA 1X. That would have left Sprint with more capital, enabled them to have better coverage, and given them more flexibility in spectrum auctions for 700 MHz.

 

That would have been ideal for CDMA users who wanted to shake free of Big Red.

 

 

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[S4GRU]

Here's where I have to disagree with Sprint only being able to get one - Sprint bought Nextel too high. If they took Alltel first, they'd have better revenue and not have to engage in a "merger of equals". They would have been able to buy Nextel at a much lower price and make faster progress clearing Nextel spectrum for CDMA 1X. That would have left Sprint with more capital, enabled them to have better coverage, and given them more flexibility in spectrum auctions for 700 MHz.

 

That would have been ideal for CDMA users who wanted to shake free of Big Red.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

This scenario is plausible to me.

[bigsnake49]

It does not matter anymore. Let's see if they acquire/merge with anyone in the future!

[Josh]

From what I have read there are several markets that have as little as 25Mhz of PCS A-F block spectrum, which hampers the ability to do any wide band PCS LTE... especially because in these markets they are not contiguous. Since I think I saw somewhere that 3G EvDO and CDMA Voice carriers were 1.125 x 1.125Mhz, eventually we will probably see most of these areas go to 2 Voice and 2 EvDO carriers because of legacy devices and M2M, and with guard bands it should fit into a 5x5Mhz slice of spectrum.  With the additional 800Mhz voice carrier and VoLTE and WiFi calling in urban areas, this should fill the needs of (a hopefully growing) customer base.  Meaning that when they fully re-farm PCS for LTE, they will have an additional 15+ Mhz of spectrum in many locations... which can only fit 1 extra 5x5 LTE carrier. 

 

Now this is not all negative, Sprint will have a 5x5 LTE in PCS G, a 5x5 LTE in SMR, +/- 60Mhz aggregated TDD-LTE at 2600 and at least 1 or more 5x5Mhz carriers in PCS A-F.  

I have a S4 that is only single band LTE, and I get decent speeds around pittsburgh, but once 800Mhz is fully deployed and they get another 5x5 carrier cleared out, it should be more than acceptable... and this doesn't even count 2600Mhz 'turbo' areas. They should be able to more than service their existing customers and have room to gain customers without crashing the network.  

 

Now one final point is that although any of the remaining regional carriers would be a boost with coverage, subscribers and spectrum, us cellular is definitely the bell of the ball.  Not only do they have complementary coverage in many of sprint's weaker spots, but they overlap enough that they should be able to save a good chunk of change after removing redundant sites & consolidating operations. They have AWS spectrum that could easily be swapped for PCS spectrum in areas that are lacking capacity for sprint.  Their 850Mhz cellular spectrum would already be compatible with many sprint phones via a software upgrade, and using this for voice in those areas could further minimize the need for anything more than 1PCS voice carrier, allowing for more LTE in PCS.  The 700Mhz spectrum could be kept and used, as many bands in a phone seems to be an issue of the past, or sold at a later date after the 600Mhz auctions actually happen. 

 

I think that they will stay independent for a little while longer, but I can see a time where sprint/softbank will need to overpay for them so that t-mobile does not get them.  

[WiWavelength]

Now one final point is that although any of the remaining regional carriers would be a boost with coverage, subscribers and spectrum, us cellular is definitely the bell of the ball.  Not only do they have complementary coverage in many of sprint's weaker spots, but they overlap enough that they should be able to save a good chunk of change after removing redundant sites & consolidating operations. They have AWS spectrum that could easily be swapped for PCS spectrum in areas that are lacking capacity for sprint.  Their 850Mhz cellular spectrum would already be compatible with many sprint phones via a software upgrade, and using this for voice in those areas could further minimize the need for anything more than 1PCS voice carrier, allowing for more LTE in PCS.

 

If Sprint chooses to do so, it can already run an additional PCS A-F block 5 MHz FDD or even 10 MHz FDD carrier in most rural areas and smaller markets.  Fallow spectrum is aplenty in those locales, since they are typically running on just one or two band class 1 CDMA1X and EV-DO carriers apiece.

 

For PCS A-F block spectrum refarming, the large markets are the sticking points.  But USCC has very few large markets -- really only Milwaukee, Omaha, Tulsa, and Knoxville.

 

So, I continue to remain skeptical about any USCC acquisition.  It brings little to the table outside of largely rural areas in a few scattered regions of the country.  I hope USCC remains independent for years to come.

 

AJ

[Josh]

If Sprint chooses to do so, it can already run an additional PCS A-F block 5 MHz FDD or even 10 MHz FDD carrier in most rural areas and smaller markets.  Fallow spectrum is aplenty in those locales, since they are typically running on just one or two band class 1 CDMA1X and EV-DO carriers apiece.

 

For PCS A-F block spectrum refarming, the large markets are the sticking points.  But USCC has very few large markets -- really only Milwaukee, Omaha, Tulsa, and Knoxville.

 

So, I continue to remain skeptical about any USCC acquisition.  It brings little to the table outside of largely rural areas in a few scattered regions of the country.  I hope USCC remains independent for years to come.

 

AJ

 

There are some areas where USCC owns spectrum and does not offer service: for example pittsburgh, DC and Boston which would benefit immediately by an additional 5x5Mhz of unused PCS spectrum.  And there are other areas which sprint might be able to swap AWS for PCS to bolster an area that is not even in USCC's current spectrum footprint.  But I think most of the benefit is the rural coverage, 5M customers, and spectrum that would allow sprint to better compete with the big 2.  Also, since they offer service in WV, it might make buying Ntelos unnecessary.  I personally also like their coverage in NC, because my family lives there and they offer service all over (outside the major metros like Charlotte, durham & fayetteville that sprint already serves). 

 

I realize that you AJ know a lot more about networks, but I thought that sprint was OK in the metros especially once 2600 is widely deployed, and it was the outskirts that could really be the game changer to the consumer's perspective of sprint. 

 

If sprint really ups its rural game with their new expansion plans (assuming they get it financed) they might not need the coverage, and the subscribers might switch anyway... then they can slowly purchase the spectrum and other assets they want as USCC exits an area.  I wish that there was room for every company to make money in the wireless game, but it seems like scale is necessary to truly compete in this era of rapid changes to technology and how we as consumers use it.  It's very capital intensive to keep up and without enough subscribers to support it with declining ARPU's industry wide, small players will either not be competitive with speed, coverage or price.  

Remember that this is also benefiting consumers with better services at better prices. I can barely remember 10years ago, I had a color screen phone that had no camera but had 1x data and I could barely go online... and it was 'cool'!

So while USCC might remain independent for years to come, I do not think it will be forever.  

[WiWavelength]

There are some areas where USCC owns spectrum and does not offer service: for example pittsburgh, DC and Boston which would benefit immediately by an additional 5x5Mhz of unused PCS spectrum.

 

No, I am not sure where you are sourcing that info, but USCC does not hold spectrum in those major markets.

 

AJ

[Josh]

No, I am not sure where you are sourcing that info, but USCC does not hold spectrum in those major markets.

 

AJ

 

well this site might be wrong then, which would make that first paragraph void. But it does say that it was updated last month. 

 

http://specmap.sequence-omega.net/

[WiWavelength]

well this site might be wrong then, which would make that first paragraph void. But it does say that it was updated last month. 

 

http://specmap.sequence-omega.net/

 

I know that site.  I know the creator.  I respect the work that he has done -- because his automation is beyond my means.  But I have issue with the imprecision.  From over 12 years experience, I know automation does not cut it.  That site gives a general bird's eye view but not an accurate snapshot.

 

So, you tell me.  What spectrum does USCC hold in Boston, Washington, and Pittsburgh?  It certainly is not PCS.  Thus, if anything, what is it?

 

AJ

[Dkoellerwx]

I know that site.  I know the creator.  I respect the work that he has done -- because his automation is beyond my means.  But I have issue with the imprecision.  From over 12 years experience, I know automation does not cut it.  That site gives a general bird's eye view but not an accurate snapshot.

 

So, you tell me.  What spectrum does USCC hold in Boston, Washington, and Pittsburgh?  It certainly is not PCS.  Thus, if anything, what is it?

 

AJ

 

The site shows PCS A block.